Level 1 To Prone

[mo1cheer]

In level 1 can you cradle to prone from a prep level arabesque (with bracer) if the backspot has a hold of both ankles?

 

[cheer25mom]

In level 1 can you cradle to prone from a prep level arabesque (with bracer) if the backspot has a hold of both ankles?

I believe so, if hips stay below chest and arms the whole time.


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[Kelly Presley]

If the flyer has hand-arm connection to someone in a thigh stand and she is in arabesque, does the back spot still have to hold both ankles to transition to prone, or can the hand-arm connection take the place of the back spot holding both ankles?

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[JJA]

If the flyer has hand-arm connection to someone in a thigh stand and she is in arabesque, does the back spot still have to hold both ankles to transition to prone, or can the hand-arm connection take the place of the back spot holding both ankles?

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Yes the backspot would still need to stay connected. If she does not then this would be considered a pyramid release move.

Because the flyer is landing in a prone position, this is considered a transition rather than a dismount because the definition of a dismount is released by the bases to cradle or released and assisted to the performance surface.

With that in mind, under L1 Pyramids B there is a clarification that states "Anytime a top person is released by the bases during a pyramid transition, the top person must land in a cradle or dismount to the performing surface and must follow the L1 dismount rules." So because you want to go to prone, she cannot be released from her group.

You should always send a video to the USASF to be sure though as that is the only way to get a definitive answer and the only proof you will be able to use to argue an misrulings at a competition.


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[Kelly Presley]

Yes the backspot would still need to stay connected. If she does not then this would be considered a pyramid release move.

Because the flyer is landing in a prone position, this is considered a transition rather than a dismount because the definition of a dismount is released by the bases to cradle or released and assisted to the performance surface.

With that in mind, under L1 Pyramids B there is a clarification that states "Anytime a top person is released by the bases during a pyramid transition, the top person must land in a cradle or dismount to the performing surface and must follow the L1 dismount rules." So because you want to go to prone, she cannot be released from her group.

You should always send a video to the USASF to be sure though as that is the only way to get a definitive answer and the only proof you will be able to use to argue an misrulings at a competition.


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Thank you for the response! I was thinking they had to stay connected. Does the back spot have to be connected to both ankles or can they just stay gripped to the one in the stunt and not grip the arabesque leg?

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[JJA]

Thank you for the response! I was thinking they had to stay connected. Does the back spot have to be connected to both ankles or can they just stay gripped to the one in the stunt and not grip the arabesque leg?

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They do not have to remain connected to both ankles in either your scenario or the OP's scenario, given that your bracer remains in contact through the entire transition. The reason is a little difficult to see but is very good to know as a level 1 coach as I anticipate a lot of calls will be made this year due to this added clarification.

So to explain this you need to know 2 things

1) that the height of a stunt (that is waist level, prep level or extended level) is determined by the lowest connection the flyer has with her base(s).

2) In order to determine whether a stunt is one legged or two, first look at the support of the flyers feet. If a flyer has support under both feet, it's 2 legged, one foot, it's 1 legged. However, if no one is under the flyers feet, you look to how many legs the flyer is supported by. A good example of this is a prep level V-Sit/Straddle Sit. Bases support the flyer under both of her legs rather than her feet and therefore the stunt is considered prep level, 2 legged. Now, in that same example (v-sit) if one base slides a hand to touch the bottom of the foot, it becomes a 1 legged stunt because you look at feet first. (See the definition of STUNT in the glossary on the USASF rules website)

So in the case of your prone transition. If your backspot were to remain connected to only 1 ankle, the minute the flyer is released from the bases (given that the backspot doesn't allow the flyers foot to go above prep level) the lowest connection your flyer has would be at prep level (because at that point your backspot is the only person connected). And because she's only holding 1 ankle, she is supporting only one of the flyers legs and it would therefore still be considered a single leg prep level skill. Because you have a bracer, this is fine, given the bracer remains in contact through the entire transition. If your flyer was in a 2 footed prep (which does not require a bracer) your backspot would need to hold onto both ankles to complete the prone legally. A lot of info I know, but hope this made sense!

If you are a USASF member though, please send a video for a ruling to be sure!




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[Kelly Presley]

They do not have to remain connected to both ankles in either your scenario or the OP's scenario, given that your bracer remains in contact through the entire transition. The reason is a little difficult to see but is very good to know as a level 1 coach as I anticipate a lot of calls will be made this year due to this added clarification.

So to explain this you need to know 2 things

1) that the height of a stunt (that is waist level, prep level or extended level) is determined by the lowest connection the flyer has with her base(s).

2) In order to determine whether a stunt is one legged or two, a judge will first look at the support of the flyers feet. If a flyer has support under both feet, it's 2 legged, one foot, it's 1 legged. However, if no one is under the flyers feet, they look to how many legs the flyer is supported by. A good example of this is a prep level V-Sit/Straddle Sit. Bases support the flyer under both of her legs rather than her feet and therefore the stunt is considered prep level, 2 legged. Now, in that same example (v-sit) if one base slides a hand to touch the bottom of the foot, it becomes a 1 legged stunt because the judges look at feet first. (See the definition of STUNT in the glossary on the USASF rules website)

So in the case of your prone transition. If your backspot were to remain connected to only 1 ankle, the minute the flyer is released from the bases (given that the backspot doesn't allow the flyers foot to go above prep level) the lowest connection your flyer has would be at prep level (because at that point your backspot is the only person connected). And because she's only holding 1 ankle, she is supporting only one of the flyers legs and it would therefore still be considered a single leg prep level skill. Because you have a bracer, this is fine, given the bracer remains in contact through the entire transition. If your flyer was in a 2 footed prep (which does not require a bracer) your backspot would need to hold onto both ankles to complete the prone legally. A lot of info I know, but hope this made sense!

If you are a USASF member though, please send a video for a ruling to be sure!




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Makes perfect sense! That's exactly how I understood it, but yes! I'll video and send in, just not sure if we will get a response in enough time. We compete next weekend!

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[JJA]

Makes perfect sense! That's exactly how I understood it, but yes! I'll video and send in, just not sure if we will get a response in enough time. We compete next weekend!

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Ahh gotcha! It does say allow 7-10 days but I've received responses in as little as 2. They are pretty quick if you follow all of the rules laid out on their website ( Cheer Questions | USASF Cheer Rules ). If you do send it I'd love to know if the ruling is different from my response! Always learning good luck to you and your team next weekend!


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[Cheeranswers]

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