All-Star Cheating With Over Age Kids On Teams!!!!

MyDaughterCheers said:

I don't know if the girl I am thinking of was rostered or not, but I am 100% certain she never once competed or practiced with the team until she got to worlds. In fact, she even posted something on her facebook the day she arrived saying something like "I just got to Orlando and can't wait to meet my team." If that is indeed illegal, I am so disappointed in that gym.

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She can legally be one of the 3 alternates as long as she is a "registered" member of the gym. To me "registered" just means that paperwork was done. Leaves a lot of wiggle room, so probably totally legal as long as the gym dotted their I's and crossed their T's.

redsmom said:

She can legally be one of the 3 alternates as long as she is a "registered" member of the gym. To me "registered" just means that paperwork was done. Leaves a lot of wiggle room, so probably totally legal as long as the gym dotted their I's and crossed their T's.

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Exactly! All it takes to be a registered athlete and eligible to be an alternate at a gym is for someone to sign them up at your gym (doesn't have to be the athlete or parent) pay the registration fee (doesn't have to be the athlete or parent, and is often waived) and placed on the list as an alternate. The "assumption" is people would not do that, and would use athletes in their program - either cheer athletes or those who may just be in their tumble program. But of course we all know what happens when we assume. So Gym A can list Gym B athlete as an alternate just in case they decide later in the year to switch gyms. Gym C can list Athlete D even though they didn't cheer anywhere all year long but if they get a bid they may want to "come back. just to go to Worlds"

Legal? Yes. Ethical? Depends on your values. Like it? No way.

tumbleyoda said:

Exactly! All it takes to be a registered athlete and eligible to be an alternate at a gym is for someone to sign them up at your gym (doesn't have to be the athlete or parent) pay the registration fee (doesn't have to be the athlete or parent, and is often waived) and placed on the list as an alternate. The "assumption" is people would not do that, and would use athletes in their program - either cheer athletes or those who may just be in their tumble program. But of course we all know what happens when we assume. So Gym A can list Gym B athlete as an alternate just in case they decide later in the year to switch gyms. Gym C can list Athlete D even though they didn't cheer anywhere all year long but if they get a bid they may want to "come back. just to go to Worlds"

Legal? Yes. Ethical? Depends on your values. Like it? No way.

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Not arguing with you! Just answering the question

gymcatmomx2 said:

There is another gym in our town that competes with my CP's gym for athletes. All the cheerleaders go to school together, cheer on their school teams together and live in the same neighborhoods... so it's obvious that we know each other's business. Three years ago they had a girl that was on a Youth team that I knew was too old.. she was in the same grade as my oldest CP and lives in our neighborhood. Their gym owner accused our owner of calling the EP 2 days before a national comp to "rat" them out. When I went to say hello to the moms at the comp I was bombarded by all of these moms telling me that our gym owner was "malicious" and "how could she hurt another child like that". They all claimed that they had no idea that she was too old - and most of them had more all-star experience than I did. In retrospect, I realize now I should have mentioned something at the beginning of the season but I honestly didn't think it was any big deal. It was only our 2nd year of all-star cheer so I was still very naive. You can rest assured that if it were to happen again I would not hesitate a second to call them out.

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You think they'd put all that righteous indignation where it should be directed, at the coach who was cheating in the first place.

MomOf2ThatsMe said:

I think she was saying that it is consistant, every year. With a mini 1 (especially at a smaller gym) you usually expect to see a large variety of body types from itty bitty 6 year olds to the occasional 95th percentile height kid who turned 9 in September. However, this team seems well experienced and is full of the latter.

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Exactly. These kids ALL look like they're 12. I've seen the program change divisions with one team at least three times (I.e. 3different divisions, age and size) just this season. It just seems odd. We have 10 teams, our divisions never change. If we have to fill in for injuries we pull from what we have. Like right now were having to teach a lv 3 level 4 flying FAST because ours just broke her shoulder playing soccer. We have small senior lv 4 flyers we could use, but it's a jr team and that would be cheating, so we aren't. I just don't think we meet teams that always play by the rules like we do or sandbag the heck out of their teams...we don't do that either. For example, we had to fill in three kids earlier in the year on random teams, they pulled three from our jr4. One filled in on a jr 1, my daughter filled in sr2 and another filled in sr3.....NONE of them threw a pass in running tumbling because the people they filled in for didn't have a pass in running tumbling. We joked about being the anti sand baggers. Another is filling in this coming competition on the jr1....she's got a new full and she's filling in because she's one of the only ones who can do three connected back walkovers. Maybe we don't take enough advantage of our fill-in opportunities, but we play by both the letter and the spirit of the rules. I just wish everyone else had the same integrity.

my eyes have been opened to so many 'questionable' things this year....some of them PERFECTLY legal, but not AT ALL right or moral!!! i for one, am veryy happy that we are at a gym that doesn't cheat, doesn't allow coaches to date athletes, doesn't use 'excessive' crossovers, doesn't allow it's parents and kids to openly use social media to bash other athletes/gyms, etc. etc, and STILL brings home the titles!!

You know, that doesn't say much for them. Being eleven years old and on a mini team would be pretty embarrassing. If they really have to cheat to win, thats how you know you're the better team. Turn them in. They are young, and they don't need to be teaching kids to win that way anyway.

UltimateRudags said:

Im 90% sure that Jamfest charges $200 to investigate cheating or an misplaced athlete.... Someone correct me if Im wrong or let me know if I am right....

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After the situation I told you about Kyle, I only was informed about an over aged athlete after the competition was held. When I made the phone call, I was told the challenge had to be done before the team in question took the floor. In my case I didn't know until after the fact, yet the team in question earned a bid. I was told that if I pursued it and could prove there was an over aged athlete on the team then the athlete would not be able to compete with them at Worlds??? They would have to use a sub or alternate. Needless to say I was shocked!

simplyfierce10 said:

After the situation I told you about Kyle, I only was informed about an over aged athlete after the competition was held. When I made the phone call, I was told the challenge had to be done before the team in question took the floor. In my case I didn't know until after the fact, yet the team in question earned a bid. I was told that if I pursued it and could prove there was an over aged athlete on the team then the athlete would not be able to compete with them at Worlds??? They would have to use a sub or alternate. Needless to say I was shocked!

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So they wouldn't lose their bid that they OBTAINED with an illegal athlete on the team?

stcchamp said:

At one of our events this year. we had an extremely bad injury backstage in warmups. we are a small gym, only 3 teams, and we had a girl on j1 get hurt. we had to pull a girl from s2 down (even though she was 16) to fill in. we told the event producers about the situation, and they said we could still compete but start with a 10 point deduction. praise jesus that they were flawless and came out to win by a large margin! and then got level 1 grand champs on top of that!! honesty is definitely the right policy!

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I dont agree with this at all. If there is an injury and no one of age can fill in then you mark the stunts or leave a hole. It is not fair for the other teams to compete against you when they are abiding by the rules. What if they had a person older to fill in to help and they were flawless. I still think that if you are over age then you are over age. Having an older person on the team is an advantage. Honest or not in this case you still had teams that lost to a team that didnt abide by the rules. I would be alright with it if you were the only team in the division.

redsmom said:

Not arguing with you! Just answering the question

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No worries. It is all good.

Reading this thread just makes me shake my head! I'm not sure why we even have rules. I'm sure there are a lot of gyms that are following the rules, but obviously there are a lot that aren't. And, it seems like it doesn't really matter if you do follow the rules because absolutely nothing happens if you break a rule.

After the situation I told you about Kyle, I only was informed about an over aged athlete after the competition was held. When I made the phone call, I was told the challenge had to be done before the team in question took the floor. In my case I didn't know until after the fact, yet the team in question earned a bid. I was told that if I pursued it and could prove there was an over aged athlete on the team then the athlete would not be able to compete with them at Worlds??? They would have to use a sub or alternate. Needless to say I was shocked!

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THIS is ABSOLUTELY ridiculous!! Why are there not stricter penalties for rule breakers!!!!

that big of a age breach is unfair...
Isee it all the time though. A team by me had a 23 year old in college competing in the junior and senior age divisions...

magical mom said:

I dont agree with this at all. If there is an injury and no one of age can fill in then you mark the stunts or leave a hole. It is not fair for the other teams to compete against you when they are abiding by the rules. What if they had a person older to fill in to help and they were flawless. I still think that if you are over age then you are over age. Having an older person on the team is an advantage. Honest or not in this case you still had teams that lost to a team that didnt abide by the rules. I would be alright with it if you were the only team in the division.

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Exactly! 10 points? Hey... You won't all mind if I slip a boy onto my all girl team, right? Just to fill in because of an injury

MissCongeniality said:

Exactly! 10 points? Hey... You won't all mind if I slip a boy onto my all girl team, right? Just to fill in because of an injury

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Only if he wears a skirt and half top!! LOL!