All-Star Petite Flyer Discrimination

AZCheerMom · Jul 10, 2012

Yes CheerBank, thank you! We as an audiance can tell if you are a "fetus flyer" who nuggets in the back during the rest of the routine or if you are just a "small flyer" that is an all around great athlete and deserves to be there!! We talk more about the fetus because well they give us a reason in a negative way. But don't worry all you small flyers out there, we see you, and your doing great!!

satxchrlvr · Jul 10, 2012

While occasionally you might see a team place a tiny girl only to fly....in my experience it seems like the tiny flyers on the senior teams are usually bringing the bulk of the tumbling. In that case, I'm sure it is just as easy for those fetus' to question the base on her level 5 team who only has a layout or can't land her toe backs...but I rarely see those posts on this board.

If every gym had hundreds of athletes to choose from then maybe you would see "older looking" flyers exclusively on senior teams and "fetus" flyers exclusively on junior teams. Unfortunately, it isn't a perfect world and gyms have to piece together the best team that they can!

HitPullCheer · Jul 10, 2012

To me, its all about the skills. You should be put on a team/position based on skills.

My schools team and 2 local allstar teams (I'm not on any) only use the short girls as flyers. No tall girls even if they have better skills.

cheerheart4life · Jul 10, 2012

bellalexi said:
I've noticed what seems to be a lot of flyer bashing on this board. I don't know if stems from resentment or what, but there seems to be unfair pressure on a flyer to be perfect in every way. I'm sure some bases would be offended if there were threads saying girls with big muscular thighs are THE best bases, hands down, and that skinnier girls just aren't as good. If you read the Cheer Pet Peeves thread, half the complaints are about flyers, and have a catty tone to them, IMO. God forbid they don't have perfect body positions, body control, body type, or even (gasp!) weigh more than their bases. There are several factors that go into choosing flyers and it's not simply because they are the most flexible or lightest ones on the team. I'm sorry if you can pull a straight spike and your flyer cannot. That was your coach's decision to have her fly. Take it up with your coach, but don't take it out on your flyer. I know this has been brought up ad nauseum, but yes, the flyer gets the kudos for a solid stunt and bears the brunt of shame when a stunt falls, especially during a competition. The fact is, while every person in a stunt group is important, flyers DO have an extra element of pressure/stress in a routine that the rest of the team doesn't. I have noticed that we tend to pick flyers apart from head to toe, looking for something to critique. If a flyer looks otherwise flawless, well it's only because she has fabulous bases keeping her up there. Can't we all just recognize that it's a perfect storm of awesomeness that makes a great team and while the roles may be different, everyone is equally important? I guess in a female dominated sport, that's not likely to happen.

Wow you said that in the best way possible! Amen girl! PREACH! :cheering:

cheerheart4life · Jul 10, 2012

12stepCheermom said:
Provided you actually know that's what they're doing. I gotta get off this thread because it's raising my blood pressure. for the record, I'm ranting...it's not directed at you Andrew.

How about if you have a girl in your gym that has a genetic disorder that keeps her ridiculously small, and hospitalized, and with a million other symptoms, including a life expectancy most of us have already passed on this board, yet that child is a fighter, gets hormone shots and pharmeceutical therapy every single night for basically the rest of her life, overcomes, is a great flyer with amazing flexibility and body contorl and is actually 12 years old and (if you have a gym that HAS ethics) won't put her on a mini team even though no one would EVER question it because she literally looks like she is 7 and the minis are bigger than she is.....

...so they put her on a junior team (because they dont lie about ages) at less than four feet tall, when she looks 7, and people assume we're flying babies and lose respect for us....

The point of the story is maybe we shouldn't pass judgement on anyone unless we actually know the circumstances and aren't just speculating.

My first year on high school, we actually had a girl like that. She was about 4 feet tall maybe add a few inches, but she was definetly not a normal sized girl. She had all the tumbling for the team, and she was an okay flyer. But she just didn't look good in the air, and it was so hard (at least I think it was) for my coach to put her on JV, knowing she had the tumbling for the team and she was only on JV because we had enough flyers. Kinda not relevant to this discussion but just saying its happened!

AndrewSky · Jul 10, 2012

I'm sorry. But if you're not tight and/or executing great body posititons, get the heck out of the air. It's your job.

Of course were going to complain if your heel stretch is worse than...well..mine...even Shamu has a better stretch than me and he doesn't have legs.
Like, all jokes aside....do your job or get out of the air. No ones saying you need a spike or a needle, but at least be tight.

SheCheers · Jul 10, 2012

CheerKarina said:
To me, its all about the skills. You should be put on a team/position based on skills.

My schools team and 2 local allstar teams (I'm not on any) only use the short girls as flyers. No tall girls even if they have better skills.

These little anecdotes that people always describe crack me up. Who cares? If its not your team, it doesn't concern you. If you compete against them, great! They're not using their best fliers! That's to your advantage! If it is your team, you don't trust your coaches and should find a new program. There. Problem solved for everyone.

MomMomMamaMom · Jul 10, 2012

My CP is the youngest on her Senior Team and a flyer, who had to prove herself. She's not the most flexible, but has the balance and body control that being a young gymnast taught her. And lucky for her she's decent at tumbling. At first glance, I'm guessing people wonder if the team is using a fetus flyer, but I'm pretty sure she proves herself out there, so I don't take it personally.

As for how people treat her, the only ones who weren't nice to her about flying were the younger ones on her original team who were flying because they were too small to base. They didn't much like having her do what she does up there, or in a case or two having to front spot instead of fly.

On her Junior team, she's actually basing, a decision that has been made due in part to the sizes and the make up of the team, and I support that completely. I think that since it's a team, the coaches have to make TEAM decisions, not individual ones, and sometimes it does come down to size. I teach my kids that they are there for their team, so this works for me....

newcheerdad · Jul 10, 2012

I want to make a thread about "petite base discrimination". It's only fair.*

*P.S. I'm not going to.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

MakeYourMark · Jul 10, 2012

So many opinions on this thread, I just cant handle it.

But seriously, its VERY hard to change people's opinions of things on this board, and this is no exception.
No sense fighting it. Theres "discrimination" towards many different types of athletes in our sport. This is a direct result from being a judged based sport, its all personal opinion.

Getyourcheeron · Jul 10, 2012

I hate to say this, but there's not really a need to get butt-hurt. If your daughter works hard to be the best flyer/cheerleader she is, there is nothing wrong. You should address the lady or the people at your gym and tell them how you feel. I honestly don't think it's that big of a deal, because i had to do some much so i could be able to fly. I was bigger than most of the girls on my team and they would be fetuses and barely able to hit a good heel stretch and I could a lot, but they wouldn't fly me because i was bigger and taller. But good luck to her and she just has to keep pushing and doing her thing.

Keep_Believing · Jul 10, 2012

Getyourcheeron said:
I hate to say this, but there's not really a need to get butt-hurt. If your daughter works hard to be the best flyer/cheerleader she is, there is nothing wrong. You should address the lady or the people at your gym and tell them how you feel. I honestly don't think it's that big of a deal, because i had to do some much so i could be able to fly. I was bigger than most of the girls on my team and they would be fetuses and barely able to hit a good heel stretch and I could a lot, but they wouldn't fly me because i was bigger and taller. But good luck to her and she just has to keep pushing and doing her thing.[/quote

Wanting to vent one time about what at times seems like a general negative attitude towards petite flyers is not getting butt-hurt. My CP loves cheer and is very happy. I choose to vent here because I love the fierceboard. It gives me an opportunity to see & hear others perspectives about things.

icheer8796 · Jul 10, 2012

In my opinion, the cheer world in general needs to stop being so overly concerned with flyers. I don't care if a flyer is tall or short, skinny or thick, a senior in high school or just reached double-digits, can tumble or just nuggets in the back for 75% of the routine - if the coach of their team puts them in the air, that's their decision. And besides, just because you see someone that you may think is a "fetus" flyer, you don't know their story and why exactly they are on that team. If YOU are not the coach (and especially if you're just a spectator) then you shouldn't be so concerned with who is in the air and why.

omgitssydthekid · Jul 10, 2012

In all honesty, I think petite flyers are almost never discriminated against unless they don't have the skills. I'm a tall flyer, I'm 5'7" and I've fought ridiculously hard for my spot even though I've always had better skills than most of the girls flying. I've based when I was needed as a base, and I've back spotted when I was needed as a back spot. I'm always up for everything I'm needed to do, but I hate when flyers act like they are too good to base or back. Nobody is too good for a position on a TEAM. Obviously I would have preferred to fly in those instances, but that wasn't where I was needed. *vent over*

AllHeartxo3 · Jul 11, 2012

bellalexi said:
I've noticed what seems to be a lot of flyer bashing on this board. I don't know if stems from resentment or what, but there seems to be unfair pressure on a flyer to be perfect in every way. I'm sure some bases would be offended if there were threads saying girls with big muscular thighs are THE best bases, hands down, and that skinnier girls just aren't as good. If you read the Cheer Pet Peeves thread, half the complaints are about flyers, and have a catty tone to them, IMO. God forbid they don't have perfect body positions, body control, body type, or even (gasp!) weigh more than their bases. There are several factors that go into choosing flyers and it's not simply because they are the most flexible or lightest ones on the team. I'm sorry if you can pull a straight spike and your flyer cannot. That was your coach's decision to have her fly. Take it up with your coach, but don't take it out on your flyer. I know this has been brought up ad nauseum, but yes, the flyer gets the kudos for a solid stunt and bears the brunt of shame when a stunt falls, especially during a competition. The fact is, while every person in a stunt group is important, flyers DO have an extra element of pressure/stress in a routine that the rest of the team doesn't. I have noticed that we tend to pick flyers apart from head to toe, looking for something to critique. If a flyer looks otherwise flawless, well it's only because she has fabulous bases keeping her up there. Can't we all just recognize that it's a perfect storm of awesomeness that makes a great team and while the roles may be different, everyone is equally important? I guess in a female dominated sport, that's not likely to happen.

Oh my gosh amen! As a flyer, I could hug you a million times for this. There is so much pressure to be perfect, because if you aren't then you're ground bound and that's the last place you want to be.

All-Star Petite Flyer Discrimination

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