High School 7th And 8th Grade On Hs Teams

[jscoach210]

Thoughts ?
When is this ok when is it not ok?
Even though it's "legal" what is Everyone's personal thoughts ??
I know some HS teams do this all the time, while others look down on teams that do this?



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[quitthedrama]

I'm guessing it depends on the state as to whether it is legal or not. It's not legal in our state unless a school has the grade(s) as part of the high school (which is likely only in small towns), but I am pretty sure it only applies to 8th grade. My district has middle school and high school as part of one campus and 8th graders can participate in all varsity/jv sports provided there are openings (can't cut anyone from 9th grade or up to make room for an 8th grader). Our high school is small, so I'm all for it. I can't think of a reason why it wouldn't be ok.

 

[coacha]

Thoughts ?
When is this ok when is it not ok?
Even though it's "legal" what is Everyone's personal thoughts ??
I know some HS teams do this all the time, while others look down on teams that do this?
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Having just had a conversation at work today with a disgruntled parent, I think I know what team the js stands for in your name.

I coach across the river, where we actually have MS sports. So I have a program for my 7/8th graders that cheers for 7/8th football. My AD would never allow me to pull up 8th graders to Varsity, but PIAA doesn't allow us to anyhow. Interestingly enough, NJSIAA doesn't allow it either, but cheerleading isn't under their jurisdiction (i.e. Not a recognized sport in NJ). But if you are trying to fight it, that might be a point to bring up.

Personally, I don't like the idea. Your high school is big enough that's it not about the numbers (no, having to drop from super Varsity isn't a valid reason) and I just don't think 8th graders and seniors need to be teammates. They are in too different places in life.

 

[coacha]

And the NJ state competition does not allow 8th graders...

 

[cheerKT]

In South Carolina, we were considered a sport and therefore governed under the same rules as all other sports. 7th graders and up are allowed to try out and be placed on sports teams for both the middle and high schools. It was that way for anything for which the middle school did not offer a team (golf, cheer, tennis, soccer, etc). For the traditional "powerhouse" cheer schools, cheer tryouts are all done together for 7th - 12th graders. C Team is the middle school squad, then you have JV and Varsity. Anyone is eligible to be placed on any team unless you document on your tryout form that you would not like to be considered for JV or Varsity. Some younger girls only choose to be considered for C Team and JV, while others opt for any team. I will say it's rare in those cases for a 7th or 8th grader to make varsity. Usually it's the cheerleaders who have grown up already doing allstars or in the gym, whose tumbling is on bar or higher than the high school girls (usually fulls or more).

The school that I coached at was not a "powerhouse" school, but we did compete. Our tryouts were done separately, but high school tryouts before the middle school tryouts. Middle schoolers were allowed to try for the high school teams, since we offered them something the middle school did not....competition. Our middle school was a sideline team only, and our JV and Varsity were competitive. Cheerleaders could elect to try out for the high school teams, and then select if they only wanted to be considered for one or the other on their tryout forms. Usually, girls would want to be considered for both.

We did not have a problem pulling middle schoolers on to our Varsity team and we did a handful of times. We always made sure they wanted to be considered for that team and that their tryout score was on par with the other girls making Varsity. My JV was made up of probably half middle schoolers and half 9th and 10th graders.

That being said, there is a large age gap there. But it's no different than the age gap you see on some senior allstar teams. Usually, the middle school girls being considered for Varsity were aware and up for the challenge. I've seen many middle schoolers kick butt and hang with the best of them at the high school level. So overall I don't see a problem with it as long as the parents and cheerleader have agreed they would like to be considered for a higher team.

 

[cheerisloving]

In VA 8th graders can only compete in HS sports that do not exist on the MS level, I think they can only do JV/freshman. So a lot of boys play JV football in fall of 8th grade, softball players in the Spring. It's good for those sports that don't really have a rec league to mold the next class. But because we have MS cheerleaders, cheer is excluded. I think it's weird that cheer doesn't get the same treatment because MS cheer is 100% grounded and doesn't compete, while HS cheer does. It is a completely different atmosphere, which is the reason for other sports are 8th graders. However, that also means we don't have 8th graders coming in with fulls, but many don't even know about the need for tumbling on the next level. Also, our MSs are smaller and so are the cheer teams so taking your 8th graders can wipe out a team. But there are some schools where it would help, I'm sure.

 

[jscoach210]

Having just had a conversation at work today with a disgruntled parent, I think I know what team the js stands for in your name.

I coach across the river, where we actually have MS sports. So I have a program for my 7/8th graders that cheers for 7/8th football. My AD would never allow me to pull up 8th graders to Varsity, but PIAA doesn't allow us to anyhow. Interestingly enough, NJSIAA doesn't allow it either, but cheerleading isn't under their jurisdiction (i.e. Not a recognized sport in NJ). But if you are trying to fight it, that might be a point to bring up.

Personally, I don't like the idea. Your high school is big enough that's it not about the numbers (no, having to drop from super Varsity isn't a valid reason) and I just don't think 8th graders and seniors need to be teammates. They are in too different places in life.

I agree so much with all of this
I look at it from my son's perspective ... couldn't imagine him being with seniors for basketball as an 8th grader


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[luv2cheer92]

In VA 8th graders can only compete in HS sports that do not exist on the MS level, I think they can only do JV/freshman. So a lot of boys play JV football in fall of 8th grade, softball players in the Spring. It's good for those sports that don't really have a rec league to mold the next class. But because we have MS cheerleaders, cheer is excluded. I think it's weird that cheer doesn't get the same treatment because MS cheer is 100% grounded and doesn't compete, while HS cheer does. It is a completely different atmosphere, which is the reason for other sports are 8th graders. However, that also means we don't have 8th graders coming in with fulls, but many don't even know about the need for tumbling on the next level. Also, our MSs are smaller and so are the cheer teams so taking your 8th graders can wipe out a team. But there are some schools where it would help, I'm sure.

Well dang, things must have changed a ton since I was in school in VA. I've never heard of middle schoolers doing HS sports, even ones that weren't at the MS level. Though there weren't many sports that weren't offered in MS. Cheer was not grounded and we competed when I was middle school (and MS competed all throughout my HS years). Just no twisting in stunts or tumbling.
ETA: We also had what was essentially a JV and Varsity cheer when I was in MS.

 

[Keep_Believing]

A very small school district not that far from where I live combines. Usually a few from 7th/8th grade make it. They are the "small" flyers.

 

[cheerisloving]

Well dang, things must have changed a ton since I was in school in VA. I've never heard of middle schoolers doing HS sports, even ones that weren't at the MS level. Though there weren't many sports that weren't offered in MS. Cheer was not grounded and we competed when I was middle school (and MS competed all throughout my HS years). Just no twisting in stunts or tumbling.
ETA: We also had what was essentially a JV and Varsity cheer when I was in MS.

The MS stunting rules could just be for our district? The infamous story attached to it is that some girl broke her arm in a cartwheel and ruined it for the rest of us. I wish this was a joke.

I don't think you're that much older than me, and the being able to do the JV sports has been done for at least 10 years? I can't remember if my brother played when he was 8th grade but I know his friends a younger than him did. The way I understand it's interpreted in the rules is that it's a decision made by the district.

 

[Twinklestars]

In our area, there are several k-12 schools. The rule is that eighth graders can play high school when their season is over as long as they are at the same physical location. Our ms football is over in October and basketball in early December. This doesn't count against their high school eligibility since it is only about a month of football and two months of basketball.

I have never seen it happen for cheer or for full seasons. I don't think that is legal here and would count against the four years of hs eligibility.

Always interesting how other places do things.


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[luv2cheer92]

The MS stunting rules could just be for our district? The infamous story attached to it is that some girl broke her arm in a cartwheel and ruined it for the rest of us. I wish this was a joke.

I don't think you're that much older than me, and the being able to do the JV sports has been done for at least 10 years? I can't remember if my brother played when he was 8th grade but I know his friends a younger than him did. The way I understand it's interpreted in the rules is that it's a decision made by the district.

Yea I talked to someone I know who is still coaching in MS and she said they are still stunting and tumbling.

It must be different, I don't think that was a thing in my county, at least when I was in school. But middle school sports were pretty big then. It could be different now.

 

[AScheer]

Our rule used to be "7th and 8th graders can cheer varsity as long as they share a campus." 5th graders were also allowed to cheer middle school if they "shared a campus." I found the rule to be there mostly to help the small k-12 or private schools. Around here those have been the only ones I've seen that utilize it. That may be why I don't have strong feelings against it. Our school and the lower one technically share a campus, so we tried to do this once. Our AD wouldn't allow it. I personally don't see an issue with it.

Where I do have an issue though, is that I've been told the new rule is not if they share a campus, but if they are all under the same board of education. THAT changes things majorly. I'm going to be doing some digging to find out if this is rumor or fact. This essentially means I can legally take the best kids from my school and the best kids from the other 3 high schools in the county to make one competitive powerhouse. Legal, because we're all under the same BOE. Our other high schools aren't competitive, so we offer a sport/activity they don't. Essentially an allstar like team, getting to chose the best kids within the entire county and take them to UCA, where other schools only have the kids in their building to chose from. I'm hoping that the talk I'm hearing is just being blown out of proportion and is not actually the case.

 

[coacha]

Where I do have an issue though, is that I've been told the new rule is not if they share a campus, but if they are all under the same board of education. THAT changes things majorly. I'm going to be doing some digging to find out if this is rumor or fact. This essentially means I can legally take the best kids from my school and the best kids from the other 3 high schools in the county to make one competitive powerhouse. Legal, because we're all under the same BOE. Our other high schools aren't competitive, so we offer a sport/activity they don't. Essentially an allstar like team, getting to chose the best kids within the entire county and take them to UCA, where other schools only have the kids in their building to chose from. I'm hoping that the talk I'm hearing is just being blown out of proportion and is not actually the case.

UCA's rule on 8th graders on varsity, 7th & 9th graders on JV, specifically says under the same board of education. But it doesn't reference 10-12. Is this a state rule your hearing or a change to UCA for next year? No help to me as we only have 1 high school under our board of ed, but I do know schools who would use that to their advantage.

 

[oncecoolcoachnowmom]

Our district does not have that. 6-8th is middle school and has its own building and team.

We do have some neighboring districts with 6-12 buildings and 6-8 still has their own sports teams/cheer teams.