All-Star Cheer Alliance 16 Competition

[ryanaarontroy]

If this is correct why didn't generals get grand?

 

[ryanaarontroy]

Side note: according to many of my friends who competed at this event.

"It was ratchet"
"New York was fun but was a waste of money"
"Disorganized"
"Hyped up for nothing"
"I hope we don't go next year"

They loved seeing their friends though from other teams!

 

[Cheer Dad]

If this is correct why didn't generals get grand?

Previously stated someplace up there. Judge/EP choice and not score based


**Quietly waiting to let the dogs out**

 

[Charolais]

If this is correct why didn't generals get grand?

Because the judges used their discretion to select the Grand Chsmpion based upon a variety of factors and not just the score.

 

[Charolais]

Side note: according to many of my friends who competed at this event.

"It was ratchet"
"New York was fun but was a waste of money"
"Disorganized"
"Hyped up for nothing"
"I hope we don't go next year"

They loved seeing their friends though from other teams!

Hopefully your friends shared those sentiments with parents and coaches.

 

[FamousxMindset]

Because the judges used their discretion to select the Grand Chsmpion based upon a variety of factors and not just the score.

In no other sport would nonsense like this happen.

 

[luv2cheer92]

I thought I heard that the judges discussed/voted between the all girl champ (Generals) and the coed champ (TGLC). Not that it was done completely randomly. Not saying that's accurate, but that would make more sense to me than just using the top score with comparative scoring.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

 

[Emily]

In no other sport would nonsense like this happen.

Why is it nonsense?

They used the worlds scoresheet which is based on comparative scoring. After worlds everyone on here complains about people/teams boasting about being "grand champs of worlds" when there is no such thing as a grand champ on comparative scoring because your score depends on the other teams in your division. Yet for Cher Alliance everyone complains that this exact thing wasn't done.

 

[DancerDude0118]

Why is it nonsense?

They used the worlds scoresheet which is based on comparative scoring. After worlds everyone on here complains about people/teams boasting about being "grand champs of worlds" when there is no such thing as a grand champ on comparative scoring because your score depends on the other teams in your division. Yet for Cher Alliance everyone complains that this exact thing wasn't done.

I believe the argument being that at Cheer Alliance, they only had a single panel of judges that scored all teams comparatively... at Worlds, we have different venues and different judging panels which is where the discrepancy lies.

I do agree with you though... people need to take a step back and realise that all-girl & coed teams are scored differently and only comparatively within all-girl/coed.

I think they compared TGLC to the rest of coed vs. Generals with the rest of all-girl to determine which team stood out more within their coed/all-girl and determined from there? I have no idea...

Pretty sure Senior Elite won grand champs at Champions League last year without having the highest score, it happens at competitions like these.

 

[FamousxMindset]

Why is it nonsense?

They used the worlds scoresheet which is based on comparative scoring. After worlds everyone on here complains about people/teams boasting about being "grand champs of worlds" when there is no such thing as a grand champ on comparative scoring because your score depends on the other teams in your division. Yet for Cher Alliance everyone complains that this exact thing wasn't done.

If it's based on comparative scoring you can't have a grand champion, so Cheer Alliance shouldn't announce anyone AS a grand champion. This is why our sport won't grow because it makes no d@mn sense half of the time. There is no way you could explain to someone on the outside that Team A won grand champion even though Team B had the highest core. That's why its nonsense.

 

[Eyes On The Prize]

If it's based on comparative scoring you can't have a grand champion, so Cheer Alliance shouldn't announce anyone AS a grand champion. This is why our sport won't grow because it makes no d@mn sense half of the time. There is no way you could explain to someone on the outside that Team A won grand champion even though Team B had the highest core. That's why its nonsense.

"Grand Champion wasnt determined by highest score this comp because they used comparitive scoring. Instead, it was a judges choice type of thing."

Thats how youd explain it....??

And yes, actual sports use a "judges choice" type of thing, too. For example, NCAA basketball tournament teams arent picked by their season record alone. Its determined by their performance throughout the season.

But this isnt why cheer "wont grow". That has to do with money and greed.

 

[FamousxMindset]

"Grand Champion wasnt determined by highest score this comp because they used comparitive scoring. Instead, it was a judges choice type of thing."

Thats how youd explain it....??

And yes, actual sports use a "judges choice" type of thing, too. For example, NCAA basketball tournament teams arent picked by their season record alone. Its determined by their performance throughout the season.

But this isnt why cheer "wont grow". That has to do with money and greed.

In regards to a basketball game the team with the highest number of points on the scoreboard is going to win its a pretty black and white situation. In cheer leading the team with the highest score still may not win, it doesn't make sense to many of us who have been involved with the sport for year and it definitely won't make sense to anyone trying to enter the sport.

There are several reasons to why cheer won't grow but best believe on the factors is that the general public struggles to understand it because a lot of the things we do don't actually make sense. I.e. grand champs when teams are scored completely differently and are judged by different panels.

Agree to disagree.

 

[Eyes On The Prize]

In regards to a basketball game the team with the highest number of points on the scoreboard is going to win its a pretty black and white situation. In cheer leading the team with the highest score still may not win, it doesn't make sense to many of us who have been involved with the sport for year and it definitely won't make sense to anyone trying to enter the sport.

There are several reasons to why cheer won't grow but best believe on the factors is that the general public struggles to understand it because a lot of the things we do don't actually make sense. I.e. grand champs when teams are scored completely differently and are judged by different panels.

Agree to disagree.

What???

Generals still won their division with the highest score just like basketball players win their games by scoring the higher than the other team...

Basketball teams who have had better seasons will get passed up for a spot in a tourney just like how generals were passed up for grand champion with the better score...

(And no, the perception of cheer has extremely little to do with its growth. No ones not joining or quitting because things "dont make sense". Theyre not joining/quitting because cheer is pricing families out, mainly due to a certain organization. The same organization that Cheer Alliance was created in spite of.)

 

[FamousxMindset]

What???

Generals still won their division with the highest score just like basketball players win their games by scoring the higher than the other team...

Basketball teams who have had better seasons will get passed up for a spot in a tourney just like how generals were passed up for grand champion with the better score...

(And no, the perception of cheer has extremely little to do with its growth. No ones not joining or quitting because things "dont make sense". Theyre not joining/quitting because cheer is pricing families out, mainly due to a certain organization. The same organization that Cheer Alliance was created in spite of.)

As I mentioned earlier there are a magnitude of reason why the sport won't grow, but the the sport isn't as black and white as many other sports are. There are many times where there is no clear winner in cheerleading, and we all question the results. While there are bad calls in basketball the overall sport is relatively simple to understand on a superficial level cheer leading doesn't make sense on a superficial level so the a lot of the general public won't entertain the sport.

We aren't talking about getting invited or a bid to Cheer Alliance we are talking about the actual competition where both teams walked onto the same mat, in different divisions, and with possibly the same panel of judges. Both of the teams had the same "spot" but the team with the highest score didn't win.

Generals won their division and had the highest score of the day period, yet they were not announced as grand champion. That will not make sense to an 11 year old, 27 year old, or a 36 year old who was flipping through the channels on their TV and randomly stumbled on a cheerleading competition. Thats my point.

 

[Ally13]

As I mentioned earlier there are a magnitude of reason why the sport won't grow, but the the sport isn't as black and white as many other sports are. There are many times where there is no clear winner in cheerleading, and we all question the results. While there are bad calls in basketball the overall sport is relatively simple to understand on a superficial level cheer leading doesn't make sense on a superficial level so the a lot of the general public won't entertain the sport.

We aren't talking about getting invited or a bid to Cheer Alliance we are talking about the actual competition where both teams walked onto the same mat, in different divisions, and with possibly the same panel of judges. Both of the teams had the same "spot" but the team with the highest score didn't win.

Generals won their division and had the highest score of the day period, yet they were not announced as grand champion. That will not make sense to an 11 year old, 27 year old, or a 36 year old who was flipping through the channels on their TV and randomly stumbled on a cheerleading competition. Thats my point.

I think that's kind of the case with most sports that have a subjective scoring component though. It's difficult for casual viewers to understand because they aren't as obsessed as we are and haven't taken the time to learn all of the rules. Like NBC still uses that system of green, yellow, and red arrows to explain scores in artistic gymnastics even though the "Perfect 10" scoring system was replaced almost 11 years ago. And, truthfully, I don't think the scoring system in gymnastics is that difficult to understand, but to casual viewers who only watch during the Olympics, a quick explanation like "the score has two components: the difficulty score and the execution score and you add the two to get the final score" is necessary to help viewers understand the results of the competition. Casual viewers probably won't understand how cheerleading is scored if they stumble upon it on TV, but the commentators can just provide an explanation as to how routines are scored or how grand champions are selected when they are announced. To clear up confusion about scoring for both casual viewers and fans of the sport, I think a universal score sheet and a Code of Points would go a long way. But I think a COP would be difficult to implement and judge so who knows.

@Eyes On The Prize I don't want to to double post, but wasn't that certain organization involved in the Cheer Alliance Competition? I thought I read they sponsored the prom or dinner or something. Not trying to argue cause I agree with pretty much everything you've said, but I just think it's sorta funny that the Cheer Alliance was formed in spite of this organization, yet they were still involved in the competition in some form. And I also think it's funny how rising costs is a huge issue because of this company, but the Cheer Alliance decides to hold their competition in one of the most expensive cities in the world during one of the most expensive times. I just don't really understand the purpose of the Cheer Alliance and this competition lol.