Crazy ideas for improving the all-star industry

[BlueCat]

i think we have one giant thread or MANY multiple threads. you put forth a lot of good ideas on here with a lot of different things to talk about.

And I just thought of another idea. At all events DII teams can have crossovers up and down levels all they want. Also, at all events, DI teams can only crossover kids on the same level so they meet age restrictions.

I'm not sure how to organize this. I'm sure there are many other ideas out there past the ones that have been put forth so far. They sort of tie together to "improve all-star", but they aren't all necessarily USASF-specific. Another issue is that I could probably rattle off a good 20+ more. I can only imagine how many other ideas are out there given the experience level some of the posters have. Maybe wait until the discussion on these tapers off a bit?

Maybe a temporary section that just gets rolled into something else after a bit? Up to you - I don't care.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

Could cheer coaches improve their year-round practice strategies by learning more sports physiology and specific training methods to combat repetitive-motion conditions? Probably. I also know that, generally, youth of today get far too little exercise. Keeping active helps tremendously with fitness level and body composition. I think that the overall trade-off is positive.

when i coached there was one coach (who was a physical therapist) and was amazing at conditioning her team (who was one of the best in the country). they were in the best shape out of the whole gym. yet at one point had the most people out. they still had injuries no matter how conditioned they were.

so while conditioning is great. it won't prevent injuries from happening.
and i dotn think a limited comp season would help this either. athletes will just push them selves more for that short period of time. and there will be more competitions back to back weekends, instead of having weekends off.

 

[BlueCat]

Summarize main ideas so far (help me out if I missed some) My apologies if I mis-credited any ideas - I was more worried about just getting a list going of the main, potentially workable ideas.

BlueCat:
1. Change "small" & "large" gym designation to self-selected Division I, Division II.
2. Single, standardized score system
2a. "Matrix" system with event-producer-multipliers
3. Sharing all category scores with all teams
4. Event producers limited to 1 "nationals" per season.
5. Fewer Worlds divisions
6. Proportional deductions (fewer skills total = higher deduction per mistake)
7. Fewer, but larger competitions nationwide
8. Rotate Worlds location
9. Split Dance/Cheer Worlds to different weekends.
10. Two "coed" senior distinctions: Limited Coed 1-6 males, Coed 7-15 males.
11. Change Worlds venue (when Worlds is in Orlando)
12. Adopt CheerSport floor marking system
13. Teams/Coaches see scores prior to awards ceremony
14. USASF requires membership of ALL athletes regardless of level.

Others:
- USASF sets standards on what events can be called "nationals". (Kingston)
- Mandatory video review of routines by category and deduction judges (allgoodpeople)
- Publish the scores, deductions, and videos of all high placing teams (allgoodpeople)
- Difficulty or "quantity" multiplier for scores to reward greater numbers of skills more (Kingston)
- Mandate a shorter competition season (heart33)
- Eliminate 4.2 & Senior Open 5 (multiple)
- Adjust level guidelines by age group - ex: senior 2s can do more than mini 2s (cash$$$)
- Decrease "large" teams to 30 from 36 (cash$$$)
- USASF creates "judging" division to coordinate reviews and certify of ALL judges (multiple).
- USASF focuses more on coach training a la USAG (xpressjag)
- Change makeup of USASF Board of Directors to be more representative (multiple)
- Membership card with photo ID required at all comps (Level5Mom)
- Limitation of level changes within a season (100%PCM)
- Increase gym membership fee to USASF (ACEdad)
- Specify crossover allowances at all events (King)

 

[BlueCat]

Organization ideas? Maybe if we break it down into categories and put them in separate threads it would be easier to follow?

1. USASF Organization
2. Worlds-specific ideas
3. Age Grid / Level issues
4. Judges oversight and training (getting them ready to judge)
5. Scoresheet itself
6. Event logistics (everything at events not in #4 and #5)
7. Other

Anyone have a better way to divide?

 

[imrichhowboutu]

Organization ideas? Maybe if we break it down into categories and put them in separate threads it would be easier to follow?

1. USASF Organization
2. Worlds-specific ideas
3. Age Grid / Level issues
4. Judges oversight and training (getting them ready to judge)
5. Scoresheet itself
6. Event logistics (everything at events not in #4 and #5)
7. Other

Anyone have a better way to divide?

does the usasf already have committees?
if so, try to split up the ideas into committee specific topics.
then under each committee they can be broken up further.

 

[Deleted member 382]

I think the id card is an interesting idea, but I agree that implementation could be difficult. What would be the turn around time for USASF to issue these cards to gyms? Often athletes join midseason, and the cards would need to be turned around quickly to ensure that the new athletes could compete. Who would be responsible for the membership cards once the gym received them? The athlete or the gym? While we would all hope that the athlete could be responsible for something like this, probably every gym has run into the problem of Sally Cheerleader forgeting something at home (shoes, bow, uniform, make-up). Right now the gym could scramble to find whatever Sally forgot, but with the cards, the gym would be scrambling to find a cross-over. Also, the athletes would be required to take the card with them into the warm up area to register, but would not be able to take the card on the floor while they are competing, so they would most likely have to be collected by the coaches anyway.

Still, I think it could be a good idea based on many of reason listed previously.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

I think the id card is an interesting idea, but I agree that implementation could be difficult. What would be the turn around time for USASF to issue these cards to gyms? Often athletes join midseason, and the cards would need to be turned around quickly to ensure that the new athletes could compete. Who would be responsible for the membership cards once the gym received them? The athlete or the gym? While we would all hope that the athlete could be responsible for something like this, probably every gym has run into the problem of Sally Cheerleader forgeting something at home (shoes, bow, uniform, make-up). Right now the gym could scramble to find whatever Sally forgot, but with the cards, the gym would be scrambling to find a cross-over. Also, the athletes would be required to take the card with them into the warm up area to register, but would not be able to take the card on the floor while they are competing, so they would most likely have to be collected by the coaches anyway.

Still, I think it could be a good idea based on many of reason listed previously.

well usasf already makes us do athlete credentialing. might as well get something for it.
maybe that can be used if we are ever questioned. not necessarily needing to provide it just to enter.

also, maybe they could have a database for producers that would have an athlete profile with their picture and information. every athlete has a number and jsut needs to remember it.

so when you register for a competition, you jsut need to say, i have athletes #101-#136 competing. and then the usasf will have a record of everyone that competed at that competition. this way you will be able to see what athletes have competed where. whether or not they are able to use that athlete at worlds etc. i think that could go a long ways.
maybe even have the gyms responsible for submitting the athletes. instead of sending in papers, they can go online to say that the athlete has been credentialed. then the only thing people have to do is send in birth certificates. the coaches can also upload their photos on this site.
then maybe usasf gets a bunch of temps that can go through the database and make sure all of the info is correct. yes the first time this happens it is going to be costly, but the cost to do this the following year should be significantly less.

 

[flcheermom]

I think the id card is an interesting idea, but I agree that implementation could be difficult. What would be the turn around time for USASF to issue these cards to gyms? Often athletes join midseason, and the cards would need to be turned around quickly to ensure that the new athletes could compete. Who would be responsible for the membership cards once the gym received them? The athlete or the gym? While we would all hope that the athlete could be responsible for something like this, probably every gym has run into the problem of Sally Cheerleader forgeting something at home (shoes, bow, uniform, make-up). Right now the gym could scramble to find whatever Sally forgot, but with the cards, the gym would be scrambling to find a cross-over. Also, the athletes would be required to take the card with them into the warm up area to register, but would not be able to take the card on the floor while they are competing, so they would most likely have to be collected by the coaches anyway.

Still, I think it could be a good idea based on many of reason listed previously.

In soccer, just as an example - the team manager/coach is responsible for the player passes..the players themselves never have access to the passes. They are kept together on a ring like key chain and given to the ref by the manager or coach. I think the same concept could be used for cheer, just keep them all together then when going to warm ups check in. I'm sure the idea sounds easier than it may actually be - but just a thought 8)

 

[Deleted member 15]

The purpose of the ID cards seems to center around stopping coaches/teams from cheating by using illegal kids. Making the coach/gym responsible for setting up the kids ID card doesn't prevent them from cheating. An independent party would have to do it, presumably the USASF, but they don't currently have the resources to do it. Are we really willing to pay enough to properly implement and ID card system?

 

[imrichhowboutu]

The purpose of the ID cards seems to center around stopping coaches/teams from cheating by using illegal kids. Making the coach/gym responsible for setting up the kids ID card doesn't prevent them from cheating. An independent party would have to do it, presumably the USASF, but they don't currently have the resources to do it. Are we really willing to pay enough to properly implement and ID card system?

id cards are not that expensive at all
for the amount of cards that need to be produced, it would be inexpensive.
every athlete already pays what, $20 for credentialing? so make it $25 and then it will pay for the whole process.
if you start the process in may, it would be fine for the next season.
maybe even make it $30 an athlete so that the usasf can hire someone to just do that.

 

[KB_Legend]

I don't think the cost of the card itself would be an issue it's all the processes involved with the cards that would be costly and time consuming

 

[tumbleyoda]

The purpose of the ID cards seems to center around stopping coaches/teams from cheating by using illegal kids. Making the coach/gym responsible for setting up the kids ID card doesn't prevent them from cheating. An independent party would have to do it, presumably the USASF, but they don't currently have the resources to do it. Are we really willing to pay enough to properly implement and ID card system?

id cards are not that expensive at all
for the amount of cards that need to be produced, it would be inexpensive.
every athlete already pays what, $20 for credentialing? so make it $25 and then it will pay for the whole process.
if you start the process in may, it would be fine for the next season.
maybe even make it $30 an athlete so that the usasf can hire someone to just do that.

I am sure that we can bump it to 25.00 or 30.00 if we know we are getting something directly out of it that will help the sport. The biggest time/expense would be setting up a secure database for it, making it accessible only to events that have an USASF sanction. This would minimize the amount of hands on it. Each comp company could have a rep that deals directly with this issue with the USASF person. If there are any issues the day of the event they would be the ones resolving it together along with the coach.

This could realisticaly be done within 2 years if we started immediatley at the end of this season.

 

[Level5Mom]

Yes it would require quite a bit of initial work by the USASF. But once it is ready I see it streamlining so many areas of our industry: credentialing, registration, worlds, checking in, age verification, crossover control, etc.

As a gym registers for a competition, they register the team roster into the division of choice by entering the athlete number in an electronic form online. Flags can be built in to prevent an under-aged athlete from registering, or a male registering for an all girl division, or a level 5 athlete trying to crossover into a level 3 division (if this were against the rules). The final athlete list is then given to the event producer and the staff members responsible for checking in the athletes at the competition.

I would say the gym keeps the cards, and team moms get the ring of cards for the competitions. The athlete verification should be done by someone in the warm up room prior to warm ups. A single person, or 2-3 staff would be responsible for ID card checks as athletes enter the warm up room. So instead of meeting your team 30 minutes before compete time, you would meet 40 minutes. Not a big deal.

If you join mid year, then you join the USASF mid year. If you change gyms, you apply for a new card with your new gym. If you dye your hair green, then you apply for a replacement card with your new picture and pay a replacement fee.

It would benefit the USASF to explore this idea by looking closer at how other organizations do it: USA Hockey, USAG, etc.

ETA: systems could be built in place for last minute injuries, subs, etc. It could be filed as a replacement if a change of roster happens before the day of the event, and it could be cleared through the ID check staff member if it is the day of the event.

 

[King]

I think it would take two years to get exactly right. First year you require everyone to register with photo ID to get their card. You do not require competitions to use these registration cards the first year, but give a monetary incentive to the comps and gyms that do. This way you have some participation from everyone, competitions can run as they normally do, and you can still have your issues and challenges pop up while trying to get everything online. Worlds would be the big event everyone is required match up the information to the stuff given at competitions that participated. Anything not found matching that first year is 'ignored' and better prepared for next year (because I KNOW there will be mistakes). That way when the system comes online the next year you are ready for the onslaught.

 

[Deleted member 15]

The additional cost I was referring to come from having someone independent setup up the athlete accounts. If I, as a cheating coach, am in charge of putting the athlete I want on my team in the system, I can cheat just as I could now. If I, as a cheating kid, am in charge of putting myself in the system, I can still cheat.

Unless there is a way to independently verify the information during database/card creation we haven't done anything to address the problem.