All-Star Extra Small As A Worlds Divison

[BlueCat]

Calling it an easy win and a training wheels division is, at best, one hell of a reach.
Teams like MACS, GBE, Vision, Desert Storm, and Champion Cheer are the teams eligible for this division. Teams who consistently make top 10 and have at one time or another globed.
Saying this division is going to be a cake walk is ridiculous, there are multiple gyms who have been in finals or who have globed in the past who will be eligible for this division. They have proved time and again they can hold their own, so let's not talk about them like they're sally and suzy's back yard worlds team.

The winner of these divisions will be strong teams that might have been extremely competitive in their Small division counterparts. However, if the division is purposely shielded from the larger programs, it is less competitive and easier to win than if it were open to everyone. That is not true in the other Worlds divisions. That certainly doesn't make it a cakewalk, but some will mentally attach an asterisk to that title. There are tons of competitions that are hard to win, but we don't crown them World Champions. People can be upset about that, but you either open it to everyone or it gets viewed with at least a tiny bit of side-eye. You can't have it both ways.

Even if it were the other way around and you could ONLY enter if you had multiple teams at Worlds, it would still be viewed negatively, IMO.

 

[mamabear]

Could the team compete as R5 at summit bid competitions and S5 at non-summit bid events/after they get a summit bid?
I could also see these gyms fielding a junior 5 instead of senior 5 as a training team now that XS is a thing.

Kind of off subject- but for those of you who are coaches or who have been doing this for a while, I am curious, is there a substantial price difference between attending Summit vs Worlds? Or for that matter, is there a difference between accepting international bids vs a level 5 bid costwise?

( I understand the FP/AL/WC for level 5s, but I have never compared different divisions or year end events)

 

[cheermomforever]

Kind of off subject- but for those of you who are coaches or who have been doing this for a while, I am curious, is there a substantial price difference between attending Summit vs Worlds? Or for that matter, is there a difference between accepting international bids vs a level 5 bid costwise?

( I understand the FP/AL/WC for level 5s, but I have never compared different divisions or year end events)

I have never looked into full paid bid amounts but as an I5 team I hope my daughter did not get less than a level 5 team....or r u talking International countries?

 

[mamabear]

I have never looked into full paid bid amounts but as an I5 team I hope my daughter did not get less than a level 5 team....or r u talking International countries?

I am sorry. I was not clear. What I am trying to ask is, is there a financial benefit attending Worlds as a XS team vs an International team, assuming that you got the same level bid? The other question stemmed from the conversation about a j5 or restricted 5 team competing as XS. Assuming again that they got similar bids, does one comp cost more than the other?

 

[TealShades]

@mamabear I see you wanted to make your post clear 3 times

 

[mamabear]

@mamabear I see you wanted to make your post clear 3 times

lol!!! I was really really really SORRY!!

 

[dat.jpp]

Hoping to see a California Flyers XS team. Love the style there teams have.

 

[XtremeWpg]

I see the benefits to smaller gyms, or gyms that are not in a populated area with a limited athlete pool.

If you're a smaller gym, and you can offer an XS team, you wouldn't be 'risking' the level 5 athletes you have leaving for other programs who can field full level 5 teams. I don't see this as a training wheels division at all. Just allowing true small gyms to field teams for their athletes skill sets. I'm sure small gyms lose their level 5 kids all the time because they just don't want to do Senior 4 again.

In smaller markets where athlete base is still growing or a small gym developing talent, I think that it offers a great opportunity for kids with the skills to compete at worlds, while the gym works on creating enough kids to field a small or medium team.

I know that where I live, XS would be a great thing to have available to us in the next couple years. We're just now getting senior age athletes with level 5 tumbling because we're a little behind the rest of the country/world.

 

[Cheerfan1234]

That's awesome! I love that so many new programs will be able to experience Worlds. Let them compete against the XS teams from every program that can field one, no matter how many other Worlds teams they have. I would assume all of these new teams in the division want the chance to say that they competed against the best in their division, yes?

I see the benefits to smaller gyms, or gyms that are not in a populated area with a limited athlete pool.

If you're a smaller gym, and you can offer an XS team, you wouldn't be 'risking' the level 5 athletes you have leaving for other programs who can field full level 5 teams. I don't see this as a training wheels division at all. Just allowing true small gyms to field teams for their athletes skill sets. I'm sure small gyms lose their level 5 kids all the time because they just don't want to do Senior 4 again.

In smaller markets where athlete base is still growing or a small gym developing talent, I think that it offers a great opportunity for kids with the skills to compete at worlds, while the gym works on creating enough kids to field a small or medium team.

I know that where I live, XS would be a great thing to have available to us in the next couple years. We're just now getting senior age athletes with level 5 tumbling because we're a little behind the rest of the country/world.

 

[dmouth11]

I'm sure it will be fine, but I'm in the "I don't like the idea of this division" camp. As someone mentioned in the Summit thread, we really need to just figure out how to eliminate a lot of these prelims teams from Worlds. Year after year, teams make the trip to perform (usually unsafe and not level appropriate routines) one time, which does not feel right. When I say this, I'm sticking strictly US allstar teams, I think I'm bought into international teams coming for the experience/inspiration, even if the skill is not there. Like Summit, all teams headed to Worlds should have what it takes to at least make finals. Semis should feel as crazy as finals in every division because it should be that close! I know money talks so it won't get to that, but I'd be more interested in changes that align to that problem.

 

[cheermomforever]

I'm sure it will be fine, but I'm in the "I don't like the idea of this division" camp. As someone mentioned in the Summit thread, we really need to just figure out how to eliminate a lot of these prelims teams from Worlds. Year after year, teams make the trip to perform (usually unsafe and not level appropriate routines) one time, which does not feel right. When I say this, I'm sticking strictly US allstar teams, I think I'm bought into international teams coming for the experience/inspiration, even if the skill is not there. Like Summit, all teams headed to Worlds should have what it takes to at least make finals. Semis should feel as crazy as finals in every division because it should be that close! I know money talks so it won't get to that, but I'd be more interested in changes that align to that problem.

They will never limit teams who go to Worlds due to ability, especially when they have a new venue to pay for and fill!

 

[CheerBank]

I'm sure it will be fine, but I'm in the "I don't like the idea of this division" camp. As someone mentioned in the Summit thread, we really need to just figure out how to eliminate a lot of these prelims teams from Worlds. Year after year, teams make the trip to perform (usually unsafe and not level appropriate routines) one time, which does not feel right. When I say this, I'm sticking strictly US allstar teams, I think I'm bought into international teams coming for the experience/inspiration, even if the skill is not there. Like Summit, all teams headed to Worlds should have what it takes to at least make finals. Semis should feel as crazy as finals in every division because it should be that close! I know money talks so it won't get to that, but I'd be more interested in changes that align to that problem.

You're not alone! Maybe making minimum scores for bids might eliminate some of those late in the season 5th place winners who scare us in prelims.

 

[AndyT_T]

You're not alone! Maybe making minimum scores for bids might eliminate some of those late in the season 5th place winners who scare us in prelims.

I would love to have a minimum required score to get a bid. BUT, not until judging/scoring is consistent. As it stands judging even from one day to the next at the same event can be incredibly inconsistent, and it is even more inconsistent between different events.

Once judges are all on the same page like they are in other sports and scores start to even out I will support a minimum score, but not yet... Unless that minimum score is like, ridiculously low to weed out only the bottom 5% of teams that attend lol

 

[AndyT_T]

I would love to see competitions stop reserving X amount of bids to each specific division. I am so tired of dangerous/janky S5 teams getting bids while IO teams who scored/performed better do not just because the competition reserved the bid for S5.

 

[CheerBank]

I would love to have a minimum required score to get a bid. BUT, not until judging/scoring is consistent. As it stands judging even from one day to the next at the same event can be incredibly inconsistent, and it is even more inconsistent between different events.

Once judges are all on the same page like they are in other sports and scores start to even out I will support a minimum score, but not yet... Unless that minimum score is like, ridiculously low to weed out only the bottom 5% of teams that attend lol

Very true. Especially with certain comps that we all side eye. Every single year.