All-Star Worlds Age Change???

[CheerBank]

I agree with everything you said. My point was this... not flying for a bit on j5 but tumbling at a level 5 is great for tumbling and not so great for flying when they make a worlds team, and flying level 5 on restricted is great for flying but not tumbling (standing) level 5 is not so great for tumbling when they make a worlds team.

My point is not about flying, it is about athletes being prepared for a worlds team in all aspects. Think about the 15 year old base who makes a 5r team and can't do a standing two to full in a routine and then makes a worlds team and is expected to do a standing one to full or two to double.

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While not flying on the J5, what would you think the athlete is doing? Standing around waiting to tumble? She would probably be taught to base, and and moving forward, if/when making a Worlds team, might base and even be good at it. There is a much higher chance of making a successful Worlds team as a base than a flyer, just look at the numbers.

Why assume the base on the Restricted 5 would move on to make a Worlds team if they did not have the tumbling for it?

Just because they are not throwing something in a routine, it doesn't mean they stop progressing in their tumbling. They would/should still be working on their tumbling outside of the routine regardless of what they throw in the routine. Want to know what mine throws in her routine? Hand-full and jumps to tuck. What can she throw? Arabian to full. But in her routine almost all passes are specialty to double, and she is not in the right place in the routine to have been put in for the specialty to full.

 

[CheerBank]

@Jonathan Brouillette I think you had posted something on minimum scores but I couldn't find the post. This reminded me of that:

Elizabeth Swaney made the Olympics despite being a bad skier

 

[alpaca]

@Jonathan Brouillette I think you had posted something on minimum scores but I couldn't find the post. This reminded me of that:

Elizabeth Swaney made the Olympics despite being a bad skier

LOL I was trying to find the right place to post this.

From the article " The odd sight of Swaney’s pedestrian performance was the end to a quixotic quest that raised questions of whether someone with inferior credentials should be allowed to game the system to become an Olympian. Does Swaney’s bid highlight the joy of Olympic participation or is it an affront to the world-class skiers that share a stage with her?"

 

[Ashley]

I think that most of the teams who go to Worlds on a passed down AL bid earned in April know that they do not stand a chance, as do the teams that earn them early in the season at a jank competition. I can understand going once for the experience. Beyond that I blame not only the coach but also the parents who finance everything for allowing it.

There are no passed down AL bids - unless you mean passing over teams that already have bids.

 

[Ashley]

Exactly. I have to remind myself that scores can't be compared across competitions. When there are different judging panels, scores can't even be compared within the same competition. Instead of scores, placement at comps is how I judge how well my cp's team is doing compared to others. When scoring is consistent and transparent, then a minimum score could be used for a variety of things.

I know that this is a Worlds thread, but for us lower level cheer families, US Finals is often the big end of the year comp. It is my understanding that last year they stopped ranking teams because it was acknowledged that scoring was inconsistent between the US Finals locations. I've been told that it was well known that the VA Beach Finals location was known for either the hardest or easiest scoring (I can't remember which) and that some teams partially made their decision about which location to attend based on that.

Someone was tweeting yesterday about being Cheersport Grand Champs and I'm not sure that's even a thing anymore? You can't compare scores across judging panels. Scores are comparative within .5 ranges, which can make a huge difference.

And in regards to your US Finals comment - I thought they used to do a video review of the winning teams from each location and rescore them against each other? It's been about 8 or 9 years since I've been to US Finals, but that's how it was when my old level 6 team won.

 

[sarah_cheergirl]

I think that most of the teams who go to Worlds on a passed down AL bid earned in April know that they do not stand a chance, as do the teams that earn them early in the season at a jank competition. I can understand going once for the experience. Beyond that I blame not only the coach but also the parents who finance everything for allowing it.

I have to respectfully agree to disagree on this one! My favorite example that comes to mind: USA STARZ - Reign in 2013. Full disclosure- I may be biased as I was an alternate for the team that year. They Got an at large bid late in the game (march, I think) and it was discussed heavily and not positively on social media. For being “extra”, “handed down”, whatever you want to call it. Keep in mind this gym had never received a bid of any kind prior to this.

They went, and placed 7th overall after being the ONLY IOC5 team to hit a deduction free routine during US trials.

I don’t remember our score at the competition where we got the bid, but I do know that many felt it wasnt bid worthy- though clearly their worlds performance was certainly worthy of being amongst the rest of the teams there.

They have done well at worlds every year since then and are in the running for a paid bid from Jamz tonight.

I say, if a team gets a late bid or “janky” bid, let them go and have a shot at it. You just never know.

 

[alpaca]

And in regards to your US Finals comment - I thought they used to do a video review of the winning teams from each location and rescore them against each other? It's been about 8 or 9 years since I've been to US Finals, but that's how it was when my old level 6 team won.

There is something called Champions Challenge which is a video rejudge of divisions winners from each US Finals location. This gives a Champions Challenge Grand Champion winner. Division Grand champ winners are announced on varsity.tv and subsequently available online. The website says that "score sheets and division breakdowns will be emailed to coaches"

So I guess that coaches of teams in the champions challenge sort of get a ranking. But it's not public and it doesn't include all teams, just the winners of various US Finals locations.

 

[CheerBank]

There are no passed down AL bids - unless you mean passing over teams that already have bids.

Yes, that is exactly what I meant

 

[CheerBank]

I have to respectfully agree to disagree on this one! My favorite example that comes to mind: USA STARZ - Reign in 2013. Full disclosure- I may be biased as I was an alternate for the team that year. They Got an at large bid late in the game (march, I think) and it was discussed heavily and not positively on social media. For being “extra”, “handed down”, whatever you want to call it. Keep in mind this gym had never received a bid of any kind prior to this.

They went, and placed 7th overall after being the ONLY IOC5 team to hit a deduction free routine during US trials.

I don’t remember our score at the competition where we got the bid, but I do know that many felt it wasnt bid worthy- though clearly their worlds performance was certainly worthy of being amongst the rest of the teams there.

They have done well at worlds every year since then and are in the running for a paid bid from Jamz tonight.

I say, if a team gets a late bid or “janky” bid, let them go and have a shot at it. You just never know.

I did say most! Congrats to your team, that is amazing.

 

[SL&AM]

The marketing has already begun---a local to us gym plans to offer all of the new levels. They are a super small gym, so it'll be interesting to see what that means. I'm keeping tabs for youngest.

 

[JumpChannel]

The marketing has already begun---a local to us gym plans to offer all of the new levels. They are a super small gym, so it'll be interesting to see what that means. I'm keeping tabs for youngest.

Really so many levels it's like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get.

 

[oncecoolcoachnowmom]

I recently saw that a gym is already marketing a "get ready for Worlds" class to make up for the changing skill sets between 4 and 5/5R now.

 

[Natalia5]

I have a totally different opinion. The current system is a huge unneeded advantage for the event producers (you have to chase bids by paying entry fees to their events). I say let practically any team attend that wishes and do away with the concept of "at large" bids. I am OK with still having paid bids or similar. The location can handle all of the Senior 5 (and international) teams at this point.

Winning the event is prestigious, IMO, because of the depth and quality of the field, not because it is hard to qualify for. Having "below-average" (by Worlds standards) teams in the early rounds isn't hurting anything.

The idea needs some details worked out.

Love this. :chestbump:

All of the event producers don't use the same scoring system or scale, so a "standard score" is problematic. None of them currently use same scoring or scoring philosophy as Worlds either.

Maybe the "WORLDS" scoring system/philosophy should become the scoring standard and the Summit system should be the standard for Summit levels too. They are after all considered the "Super Bowls" of All Star cheer. JS

 

[Lablover]

Wrong thread

 

[Ashley]

Love this. :chestbump:



Maybe the "WORLDS" scoring system/philosophy should become the scoring standard and the Summit system should be the standard for Summit levels too. They are after all considered the "Super Bowls" of All Star cheer. JS

Isn't summit scoring just the Varsity scoresheet, which is used by 90% of events already?

(I made up the 90% number, but that's probably a decent guess)