All-Star Worlds- Saturday SCORES

[Knowcheering]

It is so sad that the 29th place team was not able to compete in Finals (finished mere tenths out of 28th place, too), yet teams in the other group down through 45th place all advanced. This is not right and shouldn't happen at any competition, never mind Worlds. Don't get me wrong, some of those teams who ranked in the 40s were good, but that doesn't mean that teams finishing 29th, 30th, etc, should be getting passed over due to being in the stronger group. Why should the luck of the group you get matter at all? I feel awful for these teams. I was actually quite shocked that the judges did not allow a few more teams to advance from the tougher group in both Small Sr and Small Limited Coed after recognizing how lopsided one group was over the other. We knew this would happen-- it is inevitable that when you split divisions they come out uneven!

It can't be that difficult to organize this... In a competitive sport, we should be able to judge 50 or 60 teams. Perhaps we need to take more time to review routines on video before announcing standings. I actually thought having two separate groups was a decent idea... It made it easier to keep track who should rank where & the judges were able to take a break. But I agree with the many people who believe that BOTH groups should have been judged before announcing who moved on to Finals. How do you advance 60% of teams to Finals before even seeing the other half of the division? Why not wait until they both groups compete, advance the best teams from both groups, and then for the "bubble teams" who have scores near the cutoff line, rewatch them and make sure the right teams are advancing regardless of which group they come from?

 

[CheerBizz]

Well, how about we minimize the bids being awarded again. 60 teams in small senior is just ridiculous. I think the only way to judge them fairly is to not have so many to judge! It's just outta control and probably all about the mighty $ at this point anyway.

And I agree with knowcheering. Maybe teams should have to submit a video of their world bid routine to a judging panel and then they can decide who is worthy of spending all that time and money to traveling to compete at worlds. Hmmm...but then again lets not forget what happened with the junior division this year. What a mess.

 

[ACEDAD]

... probably all about the mighty $ at this point anyway.

Gotta say, I'm really getting very tired of this phrase.

What if we just say that every gym can only have one team because that would make everything so much easier except that it's probably all about the mighty $ at this point anyway?

What if we just say that music groups can only have a single CD every five years because that would make everything so much easier except that it's probably all about the mighty $ at this point anyway?

What if we just say that only one parent can work because that would make everything so much easier except that it's probably all about the mighty $ at this point anyway?


Cheerbizz, not trying to pick on you, but I'm exhausted with the perception perpetuated that somehow making money is a bad thing.

 

[CheerBizz]

I understand what you are saying Acedad, and with everything else in life, once $ is made there is no turning back. Just like those toll roads that seem to never get paid off or inflation in general. Worlds is a money making event just like any other type of event (I get that), but I'm just trying to think of a way to make judging more fair when the divisions are so large. It's tough in this sport since it's not so black and white, but I still stand by what I said.

 

[Mom Jeans]

Some how I think that if the groups were combined someone would've compared the scores of the first half vs the second half and come up with the conclusion that the teams that went on later had an advantage. Judges sitting there all day judging has to be tough. Do they do half one day then 1/2 the next day? I can't imagine waiting until the next day to find out if you made it to finals.

Somewhere out there someone will think of a way that is most fair, hopefully that will happen soon.

 

[heavenly]

Why would you think the group going on later had an advantage? Tired judges just want to get out of there and are bleary eyed and crazed from their long day? Can't imagine doing that all day! LOL Do you think they went to bed hearing hit, hit, hit, pull in their sleep?

I actually feel bad for the second group having to sit around all day, not being able to go in pool or a park and then competing around 8 or 9. At least the earlier teams, were done and if they wanted to come back and check out group B, they could or they were able to enjoy the rest of the day,.

 

[The Sixth]

I actually feel bad for the second group having to sit around all day, not being able to go in pool or a park and then competing around 8 or 9. At least the earlier teams, were done and if they wanted to come back and check out group B, they could or they were able to enjoy the rest of the day,.

Ha...Agreed! To a point there is not much you can do, you have X amt of teams and they all have to be scheduled somewhere. But with that said, I wish there could have been a bit more parity in the performance times. Because the schedule was behind teams performed even later. I can only say that I feel for the teams that still had to go AFTER ours. Going either early or late is fine. But in such an important competition, I think you have to provide an as even level playing field as possible for the athletes.

Somehow I think they need to find a way to limit the size of the larger divisions, which I'm sure has been discussed to no end here. But on the flipside of performing late, I don't like the idea of forcing teams to be up at 5am either as a result of scheduling such large divisions.

As for the A/B group issue, I don't think it had any impact with regards to judging, as the top 6 teams seemed to be evenly distributed at least in our division (ssrlco). But when it comes down to competition, win or lose, I want to see the best teams on the floor. So I'm still really confused why they didn't do as many have mentioned, just judge both groups and take your top X teams to finals.

 

[Mom Jeans]

I say that because I've read it before, many times. I'm not saying i agree with it, just saying you can never please everyone. There are opinions that the earlier teams get judged more harshly because the judges are not sure what the whole field looks like. This is the opinion at every comp no one likes to go first.

As for not being to play and swim and enjoy the day, that doesn't concern me. I never go to comps for recreation, especially Worlds. The comp IS the enjoyable part. Play after it's over.

 

[My3KidsMom]

Well I will say we were one of the first 6 teams to compete last year day one and we fed through to finals so while it may make some difference it don't think it makes this big of a difference. You could explain a couple but 8 teams that finished lower than you, there is just no way to explain to the kids how this happens. It is what it is and we can't change what happened this year. I just hope they get it together for next year because honestly who wants to pay all that money going on a hope and a prayer that you get the good draw in order to make it.

 

[mstealtoyou]

It's not a very hard concept to put together though, if you just organize and put the motions in gear properly.

It would have worked perfectly if they did it the way they were supposed to. Having Group A and Group B at different times, wasn't the issue. Having the same judging panel do both, wasn't the issue. That actually was the best scenario, at this particular competition, you couldn't have two different panels doing the judging. The differences in their opinions and views would have been totally unfair. Look what happens at Cheersport when you have the different divisions with the different judging panels.

The issue was taking top 18 from Group A and top 18 from Group B. It shouldn't have mattered that there were more from either group. The groups were just put together that way for performance purposes. When you put them all together in the score rankings as listed in a previous reply, you then take the top 60% (36 teams) and there are, or should have been, your final competitors.

Doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure this one out. It actually seems like a cut and dry system, easy to understand with a little common sense.

I thought this was how it was done. Surprised to hear that's not the case. I think alot of people thought it was going to be like this. Saturday night we were all begging for a combined list with scores in Sm Sr's to see who made it.

I agree it should have been handled that way.

 

[Mom Jeans]

Well I will say we were one of the first 6 teams to compete last year day one and we fed through to finals so while it may make some difference it don't think it makes this big of a difference. You could explain a couple but 8 teams that finished lower than you, there is just no way to explain to the kids how this happens. It is what it is and we can't change what happened this year. I just hope they get it together for next year because honestly who wants to pay all that money going on a hope and a prayer that you get the good draw in order to make it.

Believe me, I get it. I would feel exactly how you feel if that happened to us. There's nothing you can say to those kids to make them feel better. Hopefully next year there's a better plan.

 

[heyitstopher]

oinhrogaoug is anyone EVER going to post scores...

 

[socratesofcheer]

Why does the USASF get the blame?
Your team decided to go to worlds.
Your team complained last year that there were too many teams in prelims and should be split.
Your team complained last year that paid bids went last.
Your team knew that they were taking the top 18 from each side to finals.
The USASF split teams just like YOU wanted.
The USASF did random performance order for prelims just like YOU wanted.
The USASF added 10% more teams for finals to account for a "stronger" side.

If you don't like the way it's handled then don't go to worlds! Stop blaming others because you were not in the top 18.

FYI this is not intended for one person specifically, it is specifically intended for everyone!

 

[cheerislove8]

Why does the USASF get the blame?
Your team decided to go to worlds.
Your team complained last year that there were too many teams in prelims and should be split.
Your team complained last year that paid bids went last.
Your team knew that they were taking the top 18 from each side to finals.
The USASF split teams just like YOU wanted.
The USASF did random performance order for prelims just like YOU wanted.
The USASF added 10% more teams for finals to account for a "stronger" side.

If you don't like the way it's handled then don't go to worlds! Stop blaming others because you were not in the top 18.

FYI this is not intended for one person specifically, it is specifically intended for everyone!

Thank you!! Very well said.


Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk

 

[ACEDAD]

Why does the USASF get the blame?
Your team decided to go to worlds.
Your team complained last year that there were too many teams in prelims and should be split.
Your team complained last year that paid bids went last.
Your team knew that they were taking the top 18 from each side to finals.
The USASF split teams just like YOU wanted.
The USASF did random performance order for prelims just like YOU wanted.
The USASF added 10% more teams for finals to account for a "stronger" side.

If you don't like the way it's handled then don't go to worlds! Stop blaming others because you were not in the top 18.

FYI this is not intended for one person specifically, it is specifically intended for everyone!

I agree with the thrust of this. Except:

1. The change in performance order from paid last to random must have been announced in an empty conference room. I found out accidentally in March; the owners of GA, Cheer Athletics and CEA found out at the NAB meeting in April. Ordinarily, I would say those are 4 people that stay in pretty close touch with USASF information. If we didn't know, it's very likely others didn't as well.
2. The division split wasn't announced until the schedule came out. Not that I think it's a horrible idea or a great idea, but it wasn't announced in time for anyone to make a decision whether or not to attend Worlds or not.

Transparency is the key. We may all have disagreements on what the rules or procedures should be and we should fight very hard for what we believe is correct.

But once the rules are set; they should stay the same for the entire season. Make changes for the next season if needed.