All-Star Your Definition Of A World's Caliber Team

[CDRCoach17]

I am curious to what everyone thinks a "world's caliber team" consists of. I have read so many posts about this team belongs, but this team doesn't. I firmly understand certain divisions have WAY too many teams in them.
As a coach however, would you like to be the person to tell your kids that we probably shouldn't go because we don't stand a chance? If that were the case, I'm sorry to say it but worlds would only have maybe 10-15 teams in each division. That vast majority of teams going to worlds set a goal of just making it to day 2. Then you have to the top competitors who are trying to catch the gold.
I have taken 1 team to worlds in 2008 before small limited was created. We had to compete in regular limited coed. Our kids earned a bid at a competition 2 weeks before worlds. We are not a gym that bid chases, and it was the only competition where we could qualify for a bid. I was reluctant, but I had 10 seniors on the team who wanted go. So basically my team went for the experience, and finished 2 points from makng it to day 2. Proudest moment of my coaching career. Thoughts please

 

[newcheerdad]

I've seen it in all sorts of sports (not just cheer) where teams enter a competition that they're not likely do well in. Heck, look at the NCAA basketball tournament - realistically, there are probably 15-20 teams that have a legitimate change of winning. For everyone else, the goal is generally to win a game, maybe two. So why not let these teams compete?

Are there too many bids available - to the point where it's watered down the meaning of getting a bid to Worlds? I guess so, but as long as event producers are willing to fork over money for paid bids and the attached at-large bids that come with them, then you're going to have situations where the 10th place team in small senior's going to get an at-large because everyone else already got their bid.

But as I've said elsewhere...there's no consistent scoring rubric or universal scoresheet, so it's pretty much impossible to impose a minimum standard for being a Worlds qualifier. (the way that other sports do)

 

[Just-a-Mom]

I have found that a lot of people on here do NOT like to see anyone but the "top dogs" make it to Worlds.

I don't think it's fair to say someone doesn't deserve to go because you don't like the judging at the competition they got their bid at. Don't think it's fair? Fight the system, not the team that got the bid. Maybe they don't have the same amount of awesomeness as some of the top teams. So they go and don't get to Day 2. They're still happy as could be to even be there. Maybe, just maybe, you might be surprised to see what they can do.

There are countries that send teams to the Olympics that everyone is like "Seriously??? Who are they kidding with this???" (Jamaican Bobsled team, anyone?) And usually they don't make it past the first rounds. But they are still there, tears streaming down their faces, just happy to have even gotten to go.

I think of paid bids like sponsorships, since they come from EP's. If the EP wants to pay for someone's trip to Worlds and they don't want to pay for someone else's, that's their decision. I don't see why people are so against these little unknown teams going to Worlds.

I think a Worlds caliber team is one that is able to get a bid. Period.

 

[garretttt]

worlds is for level 5/6. if you are a decent level 5/6 team. you are a worlds caliber team.

 

[wcsstilldeath]

I agree with @Just-a-Mom a worlds caliber team is one that has a bid, because for every cent of that bid, they worked their butts off to get those skills. Most of these teams wont make it past pre-lims but they still get the amazing experience of competing at worlds. Day one and day one separate the elite from the supreme but to even make it to worlds is a privalege and every team there is above a certain caliber.

 

[dmouth11]

I really like this discussion and have been waiting for it for a while now. I'm one the "there are WAY too many bids offered these days" team and I think its pointless to send a team to worlds if you have no shot of winning... As in, TeamX can drop 3 stunts, have 6 touchdowns and would still beat you. It's not a matter of big name/ less known gym, but rather if the team has the potential to max out the score sheet if they hit a perfect routine (that to me is a world caliber team). I seriously can't stand when teams show up at worlds with 4ish shaky fullups, a bunch of running layouts and maybe 2 or 3 non specialty doubles, etc etc. I especially get annoyed because A LOT of junior teams deserve to be there over those teams and yet they got cut out. Not to say that almost every team heading to worlds is working their butt off, but at the same time I think that the only kids that deserve to be on that World's stage are the ones with the polished skill set to grab a globe.

 

[MyssMyst]

So, in that logic, no one should compete in Lg Sr if they're not CEA, F5, or SS? I think that even the shaky teams can benefit from it. Why? Their coaches get to see up close and personal what other teams are doing, youtube just isn't the same. Also, it lets that team see a team that is amazing, and get the inspiration to come back next year even stronger. If I coached, and my parents were ok with going, I'd take my kids, even if they were shaky. However, they'd have homework. They'd be watching the other gyms compete, and be taking notes on what those teams did well. Give them a chance to practice scoring routines, and go over the scores together at the gym the next week. What did the top teams have in common/what did they do differently? How did teams handle bobbles/falls? If a coach of a shaky team does this right, that's one massive educational opportunity. They have no shot at winning, but they can learn, and learn tons. Learning, to me, is the ultimate goal of competition, at any level, in any sport. Winning is the icing on the cake.

Are there too many bids given out? Probably. Do I really care? No. It's not costing the "big" teams anything to have the other teams there. At the worst, they have a few more people screaming for them when they take the mat, and have more competition in future. Every program has to start somewhere. Let them watch and learn from the best. I didn't always feel this way, but the more I look at it, the less I really care how many teams there are. It's none of my business how each team spends their money.

 

[dmouth11]

My thing is that the image of World's as being the best of the best competition needs to be revived... The whole, shaky team X should go to see what they need to be doing argument etc can be solved if teams attended Cheersport and/or NCA, or other really big comps. I really think teams should not be on that mat for only the "experience"... takes away from the elite air of World's and what the competition is all about.

 

[cupieqt]

My thing is that the image of World's as being the best of the best competition needs to be revived... The whole, shaky team X should go to see what they need to be doing argument etc can be solved if teams attended Cheersport and/or NCA, or other really big comps. I really think teams should not be on that mat for only the "experience"... takes away from the elite air of World's and what the competition is all about.

Worlds is our highest level of competition. It is up to us to keep it free from becoming just another comp anyone can attend as long as you have the money and an invite.

Why SHOULD teams that aren't capable of competing well at this level be allowed to compete "just for the experience"? If that's the case then I want to go! I have a senior coed 3 that could throw some scary level 5 skills--can we get a bid too? Please? We wont expect to win and we will really learn a lot, I promise!
Or maybe we should try to maintain the integrity of Worlds by keeping it only for the elite---so when we actually DO get there it's not a joke bc anyone can go now....

 

[RockstarCheer]

Wow...Some people need to get over themselves. Worlds is amazing and the opportunity is there for everybody. If you get a bid, you go to Worlds. It can be great for everybody's own business. It can at some times help further grow their business. Kudos to all attend Worlds and get to enjoy the experience. I love the bid process and enjoy all the representation of programs at Worlds.

 

[cupieqt]

Wow...Some people need to get over themselves. Worlds is amazing and the opportunity is there for everybody. If you get a bid, you go to Worlds. It can be great for everybody's own business. It can at some times help further grow their business. Kudos to all attend Worlds and get to enjoy the experience. I love the bid process and enjoy all the representation of programs at Worlds.

I thought we were supposed to express how we felt about it? I'm glad the opportunity is there for me when I've worked to grow my gym from the littles up. I guess I just resent those who try to take short cuts....I wouldn't really want to bash on any team that got a bid when they worked hard. I just believe in consistency more than luck I guess!

 

[socratesofcheer]

So, in that logic, no one should compete in Lg Sr if they're not CEA, F5, or SS? I think that even the shaky teams can benefit from it. Why? Their coaches get to see up close and personal what other teams are doing, youtube just isn't the same. Also, it lets that team see a team that is amazing, and get the inspiration to come back next year even stronger. If I coached, and my parents were ok with going, I'd take my kids, even if they were shaky. However, they'd have homework. They'd be watching the other gyms compete, and be taking notes on what those teams did well. Give them a chance to practice scoring routines, and go over the scores together at the gym the next week. What did the top teams have in common/what did they do differently? How did teams handle bobbles/falls? If a coach of a shaky team does this right, that's one massive educational opportunity. They have no shot at winning, but they can learn, and learn tons. Learning, to me, is the ultimate goal of competition, at any level, in any sport. Winning is the icing on the cake.

Are there too many bids given out? Probably. Do I really care? No. It's not costing the "big" teams anything to have the other teams there. At the worst, they have a few more people screaming for them when they take the mat, and have more competition in future. Every program has to start somewhere. Let them watch and learn from the best. I didn't always feel this way, but the more I look at it, the less I really care how many teams there are. It's none of my business how each team spends their money.

I think if you ask the coaches of the top sm sr and sm limited divisions they may disagree with you on not costing the big teams anything. I think these coaches want to be judged side by side to see who really is the best, having a large number of teams that are incorporated into the performance order can very well prevent that.

 

[RockstarCheer]

I thought we were supposed to express how we felt about it? I'm glad the opportunity is there for me when I've worked to grow my gym from the littles up. I guess I just resent those who try to take short cuts....I wouldn't really want to bash on any team that got a bid when they worked hard. I just believe in consistency more than luck I guess!

Short Cuts?? The rules are the rules and if someone gets a bid who are you to say they took a shot cut? Don't hate the player, hate the game

 

[whOaaatheree]

My thing is that the image of World's as being the best of the best competition needs to be revived... The whole, shaky team X should go to see what they need to be doing argument etc can be solved if teams attended Cheersport and/or NCA, or other really big comps. I really think teams should not be on that mat for only the "experience"... takes away from the elite air of World's and what the competition is all about.

so please tell me how you differentiate between the teams that "deserve" to be there and the teams that "don't deserve" to be there just for the experience.

 

[newcheerdad]

Worlds is our highest level of competition. It is up to us to keep it free from becoming just another comp anyone can attend as long as you have the money and an invite.

Why SHOULD teams that aren't capable of competing well at this level be allowed to compete "just for the experience"? If that's the case then I want to go! I have a senior coed 3 that could throw some scary level 5 skills--can we get a bid too? Please? We wont expect to win and we will really learn a lot, I promise!
Or maybe we should try to maintain the integrity of Worlds by keeping it only for the elite---so when we actually DO get there it's not a joke bc anyone can go now....

I think there is some legitimacy to the idea that too many teams get Worlds' bids - but the truth is that a.) it's not likely to change anytime soon and b.) inevitably, the cream rises to the top anyway.

But I will say that not every gym subscribes to the "we have to field a Worlds team" philosophy. Some, like my cp's, are happy being competitive and successful at lower levels. (at least for the time being) However, as suggested in another thread, in other areas having a Worlds team is almost necessary for survival.