All-Star Which Competitions Will Still Score And Rank Special Needs Teams This Season?

[Official OWECheer]

I am in 100% agreement with you that this division should be judged. In addition, I have seen the special needs division awards ceremony each year I have been to NCA and Cheersport and saw the fewest sad tears there than any other division awards. However, from what I understand, both NCA and Cheersport received a lot of complaints about the judging of the special needs division - apparently so much so that they both felt enough pressure to change their system. In general, gym owner complaints are fueled by parent complaints - so I am going to assume that there were many Susie's moms who were not happy and let their gym owners hear about it. Both EPs have said that they are working to create a new scoresheet for the division. Both EPs have gone above and beyond for this division so I have to think they had a very valid reason for the change, but I don't think it stemmed from the athletes themselves.
I hope something can be resolved so that these athletes can go back to being treated like every other athlete at these comps and can experience the thrill of victory and the agony of defeat.

Bill said the same thing on Twitter.

 

[SL&AM]

I hope they figure out a way to still judge and rank these athletes. This is my first year as a special needs athletes mom (non-CP) and none of the performances they are doing are ranked/judged. As much as that annoys me, I'm just happy at this point that she has/found a team that works for her.

 

[dawgshow]

I've been following this since it was tweeted. I have to say that it's been interesting to read different perspectives. It never occurred to me that it would be such a hot button because locally all SN needs teams are exhibition only. In fact, it was only a couple of years ago that I realized that competitive SN teams even existed. Thanks for opening my eyes, all. I hope it works out favorably quickly.

 

[icame2WERQ]

I'm all for special needs teams to compete just exhibition.. I've been judging for a couple of years now, and honestly judging special needs teams is ALOT OF WORK! and I'm not saying that should be the reason why we shouldn't judge them, but judging special needs teams is completely different!

I specifically remember the first time I judged a special needs division --- I judged 2-3 teams, and this one special needs team only had 1 special athlete, and the 3-non special athletes assisted her, and made the routine all about her! Which i thought was cute, but how do you judge her against a team full of special needs athletes, and how do you justify it ? "In order to be more competitive, recruit more special athletes to field a team" ...

 

[SparkleSpankies]

The issue I have is some special needs teams have legitimate routines with minimal helpers, that is a lot more logical to be judged. The hardest part about judging most special needs routines is that the helpers do so much. I feel some programs should be and can be judged, it is so impressive and inspirational to see them work so hard to accomplish so much and have so much fun, but it also is about the experience. Judged or exhibition, it is equally inspirational and rewarding.

I feel if teams are judged, perhaps put limitations on the helpers. Just my opinion.

 

[fiercerando88]

The issue I have is some special needs teams have legitimate routines with minimal helpers, that is a lot more logical to be judged. The hardest part about judging most special needs routines is that the helpers do so much. I feel some programs should be and can be judged, it is so impressive and inspirational to see them work so hard to accomplish so much and have so much fun, but it also is about the experience. Judged or exhibition, it is equally inspirational and rewarding.

I feel if teams are judged, perhaps put limitations on the helpers. Just my opinion.

Create a divisioning/leveling/category system. We do that in special Olympics. For unified basketball (our most popular and most contentious sport), for example, we have 2 categories. Cat 1 partners (do not have a disability) can shoot/pass/defend/etc right along w the athletes. Cat 2 partners pass to the athletes, but can not shoot or defend. In cheer, cat 1 could have helpers stunt, cat 2, helpers would just spot the stunt. Maybe it's a ratio, 1/3 of your team can be helpers who assist with stunting. Idk. Both could be scored. If people wanted, you could still have an exhibition category too. It would need to be ironed out more in depth of course, this is all rattling off my head in the past five minutes. Have a committee with coaches, parent and athlete reps (their view is extremely important and valuable), and ep reps. It would take time, and manpower. Probably some coaches education (again we do this in SO). But it is possible and could work well. I understand that this is 'newer' than SO, but in the scheme of things there is a lot that can be learned from the organization. I am happy to offer my services and connections if any eps are interested.

Do some people still complain? Of course, welcome to the nature of the beast that is sports. But IMO, not being scored or having the option even, and letting that be okay is just doing a disservice to all involved.


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[icame2WERQ]

Create a divisioning/leveling/category system. We do that in special Olympics. For unified basketball (our most popular and most contentious sport), for example, we have 2 categories. Cat 1 partners (do not have a disability) can shoot/pass/defend/etc right along w the athletes. Cat 2 partners pass to the athletes, but can not shoot or defend. In cheer, cat 1 could have helpers stunt, cat 2, helpers would just spot the stunt. Maybe it's a ratio, 1/3 of your team can be helpers who assist with stunting. Idk. Both could be scored. If people wanted, you could still have an exhibition category too. It would need to be ironed out more in depth of course, this is all rattling off my head in the past five minutes. Have a committee with coaches, parent and athlete reps (their view is extremely important and valuable), and ep reps. It would take time, and manpower. Probably some coaches education (again we do this in SO). But it is possible and could work well. I understand that this is 'newer' than SO, but in the scheme of things there is a lot that can be learned from the organization. I am happy to offer my services and connections if any eps are interested.

Do some people still complain? Of course, welcome to the nature of the beast that is sports. But IMO, not being scored or having the option even, and letting that be okay is just doing a disservice to all involved.


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I don't view it as a disservce unless they're not receiving CONSTRUCTIVE comments from the judges which I think are much more important than rankings!

 

[SparkleSpankies]

Create a divisioning/leveling/category system. We do that in special Olympics. For unified basketball (our most popular and most contentious sport), for example, we have 2 categories. Cat 1 partners (do not have a disability) can shoot/pass/defend/etc right along w the athletes. Cat 2 partners pass to the athletes, but can not shoot or defend. In cheer, cat 1 could have helpers stunt, cat 2, helpers would just spot the stunt. Maybe it's a ratio, 1/3 of your team can be helpers who assist with stunting. Idk. Both could be scored. If people wanted, you could still have an exhibition category too. It would need to be ironed out more in depth of course, this is all rattling off my head in the past five minutes. Have a committee with coaches, parent and athlete reps (their view is extremely important and valuable), and ep reps. It would take time, and manpower. Probably some coaches education (again we do this in SO). But it is possible and could work well. I understand that this is 'newer' than SO, but in the scheme of things there is a lot that can be learned from the organization. I am happy to offer my services and connections if any eps are interested.

Do some people still complain? Of course, welcome to the nature of the beast that is sports. But IMO, not being scored or having the option even, and letting that be okay is just doing a disservice to all involved.


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Great Idea.

 

[quietmom]

I don't view it as a disservce unless they're not receiving CONSTRUCTIVE comments from the judges which I think are much more important than rankings!

Please don't get me wrong. The exhibition division has its place, and it is a good thing for special needs teams that are just starting out or feel they are better served in this division. However, for some of the teams with the older athletes who really invest a lot of time and energy into their sport, do stunts without few to no helpers, and who truly hit, it is not exactly fair to them to be forced into this category. As I have said previously, being judged/scored should really be a choice.

There are some competitions where for special needs athletes, they are allowed to perform, praised for how great they are afterwards, and then sent home with a pat on the back and a bunch of praise with little to no constructive feedback or input from the judges. While the experience of the competitions is great and the athletes are really treated well by everyone, it just doesn't give the teams with the older, hard working athletes who do their stunts with few to no helpers the credit that they have earned. I just worry that it will just stay exhibition only and never be scored/placed again, and that would be a shame.

However, I trust what @ACEDAD has said on twitter. NCA and Cheersport have been nothing but excellent to special needs teams in the past. I am going to give them the benefit of the doubt and trust them that they will live up to their word. It would really be nice if they did include the older special needs athletes in their decisions in the future thou when it comes to decisions that directly impact their teams.

 

[Tosh]

Very interesting conversation....I have to agree with @fiercerando88 in order for this to be judged somewhat fairly there needs to be divisions. there are many various levels/kinds on disabilities so without some shor to dividing factor it is impossible to compete fairly. However, one must take into consideration that there are not enough teams or SN participants in the sport to consider making divisions. If this is done at this stage, everyone will still win a medal because the numbers are just not there to support this. hopefully sometime in the near future with bringing more awareness to the sport for SN's athletes, it will grow to become competitive. Many make mention of the special olympics; however, you will notice that these athletes are usually older and have spent a significant amount of time working on their sport......and we are talking about the olympics.....where cheer is not even a factor. So lets take a step back and try to look at the whole picture and see what happens.....

 

[ASCheerMan]

Sidenote: When NCA moved Special Needs OUT of the arena last year, there were folks on here who were of the mind of "OMG why would they do that?" I get it. It's a valuable lesson for the kids. You (like other kids) don't always get to compete where you want to, in the time slot that you want, and that's okay.

We didn't move Special Athlete teams out of the Arena last year.

 

[quietmom]

Very interesting conversation....I have to agree with @fiercerando88 in order for this to be judged somewhat fairly there needs to be divisions. there are many various levels/kinds on disabilities so without some shor to dividing factor it is impossible to compete fairly. However, one must take into consideration that there are not enough teams or SN participants in the sport to consider making divisions. If this is done at this stage, everyone will still win a medal because the numbers are just not there to support this. hopefully sometime in the near future with bringing more awareness to the sport for SN's athletes, it will grow to become competitive. Many make mention of the special olympics; however, you will notice that these athletes are usually older and have spent a significant amount of time working on their sport......and we are talking about the olympics.....where cheer is not even a factor. So lets take a step back and try to look at the whole picture and see what happens.....

Special Olympics start at age 8

 

[oncecoolcoachnowmom]

We didn't move Special Athlete teams out of the Arena last year.

My apologies! Maybe I just imagined that discussion happening?

 

[fiercerando88]

Very interesting conversation....I have to agree with @fiercerando88 in order for this to be judged somewhat fairly there needs to be divisions. there are many various levels/kinds on disabilities so without some shor to dividing factor it is impossible to compete fairly. However, one must take into consideration that there are not enough teams or SN participants in the sport to consider making divisions. If this is done at this stage, everyone will still win a medal because the numbers are just not there to support this. hopefully sometime in the near future with bringing more awareness to the sport for SN's athletes, it will grow to become competitive. Many make mention of the special olympics; however, you will notice that these athletes are usually older and have spent a significant amount of time working on their sport......and we are talking about the olympics.....where cheer is not even a factor. So lets take a step back and try to look at the whole picture and see what happens.....

Actually this isn't entirely true, I'm not sure about most states, but I know in the New England Special Olympics states, majority of athletes are school-aged. Many drop off when they don't have a school-based organization to participate with, or they get jobs or whatever. Many also grow out of their sports, just like typical adults. How many 50 year olds do you know run track like they did in hs? The aging SO population with numbers dwindling is a real thing in many states. Also, in regards to them spending a significant amount of time practicing their sport, most SO athletes have to practice for 10 weeks, 2x/ week prior to the state games. That's all that's required. For those that have done all star, I can almost guarantee that they practice way more than that.

Also, there is SO cheerleading in many states now. So if people want to be scored, feel free to leave your all star gym and head on over to your local SO program! (Note: I don't necessarily want this to happen, I love that the all star world has included individuals with disabilities. It truly combines two of my biggest passions. However if I was a parent of an athlete, guess what, we'd be leaving the all star world and headed to SO where my kid was treated as an equal.)

Also, for divisioning in SO, you have to have at least three people in a division. Given the number of gyms that now have SN teams, I'm pretty sure we could make it work for at least two divisions without everyone winning a medal.

I'm sorry I don't mean to attack, sorry if it comes off that way. This is a very hot button topic for me and there are so many opportunities for this to be great. But not scoring isn't one of them.


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[quietmom]

There were quite a few special olympics programs that participated in cheersport. SO has partnered with some gyms and sponsored some sn teams and they do compete in Allstar competitions under the unified program.