All-Star Level 2 Teams Not Being Co-ed

[cyngirl]

Am I the only one who thinks that having 4 MEN on a LEVEL 2 team is just unfair!! I'm not a sore sport by any means, and I can see one or 2 males at level 2 and under not being considered c0-ed. BUT 4???? I have watched this same team win over and over against much better teams that just can not get their tumbling, basket and stunt scores as high. Not with a man in every single stunt. And then to see that EXACT same team go for Senior Level 3 Co-Ed!?? Its just so frustrating. The judges can only do their job legally and they do, but why does the USASF care more about glitter make up and how much your belly shows, than this issue?!! If anyone can explain to me, I really appreciate it.​

 

[xomckenzieee]

My guess would be because guys come in handy when doing difficult extended stunts and since at level 2 there's not as much "difficult" stunting involved, the guys really don't change a team's skill level.

 

[DaniV]

We have two boys on my level.two junior team and one of them makes a huge difference in my stunts but more for his strength than anything else. He is the base for my weakest flyer who needs basically a brace to stay up and throws one of my lower baskets. He does dos walk in hands but that is about the only unique "co-ed" aspect that he brings to the team- he is just incredibly strong but I have some girls as well that could rival his strength.

I cam definitely see both sides to this argument and its a tricky one to take a side on.

Sent from my SGH-i667 using Board Express

 

[Drkilluzionz]

I have three boys on my senior two and honey y'all aren't missing anything...:banghead:

 

[yourfavoritebackspot]

this is one of the reason I never understood why Jr coed 4 division was dropped, I think coed v/s all girl makes a difference in stunting and usually tumbling specialty passes.

 

[OnceUponACheerleader]

my mom always gets so angry when she watches a 'coed team' with only one or two male team members, and there are no specialty 'co-ed' stunts, maybe they'll back or base an all girl group. and she always asks 'why is this coed, to me it looks like all girl stunting with one boy'.

 

[12stepCheermom]

this is one of the reason I never understood why Jr coed 4 division was dropped, I think coed v/s all girl makes a difference in stunting and usually tumbling specialty passes.

I will agree with this. I think the lack of distinction only applies when having a boy really isn't a substantial advantage. At level 1-3, younger than juniors, i dint really think it is an advantage. However, starting at the junior age bracket, and definitely in level 4 stunting having boys IS an advantage. My son is 14 (last year of junior eligibility) is 6-1 and 150lbs and can toss to hands with senior flyers... He can toss extension with the smaller junior ones. Now it's not in our routine (which I wish it were) but there aren't a lot of AG teams out there that can do that. I would imagine my son is not the only junior 4 that can. There are two of them that can do that on his team. I imagine if you had four or five.... That's a huge advantage over an AG team.

 

[Just-a-Mom]

I agree that a large part of it is that the skills involved aren't as affected, but really I think the main reason is number of teams. How many coed teams are there really that are level 3 and below? Even if usasf made a division split it would never get used, since coed splits are usually only used when there will be 2+ teams in each split. How often do you see more than one coed level 1 or 2 team at a comp?

More division splits? No thanks.

 

[Drkilluzionz]

I still cant imagine having to teach my level 2 boys cheer fundamentals (which if you coach males you know its often hit or miss) tumbling and some sort of partner stunting (that was responsible for part of the scoresheet) as well...

 

[Babs]

Am I the only one who thinks that having 4 MEN on a LEVEL 2 team is just unfair!! I'm not a sore sport by any means, and I can see one or 2 males at level 2 and under not being considered c0-ed. BUT 4???? I have watched this same team win over and over against much better teams that just can not get their tumbling, basket and stunt scores as high. Not with a man in every single stunt. And then to see that EXACT same team go for Senior Level 3 Co-Ed!?? Its just so frustrating. The judges can only do their job legally and they do, but why does the USASF care more about glitter make up and how much your belly shows, than this issue?!! If anyone can explain to me, I really appreciate it.​

I hate that some teams actually do compete down for certain competitions. I would like to see USASF take more interest in things like this than in glitter makeup or belly buttons showing!

 

[cheeeeer93]

How much of a coed stunt score can you give in level 2? Most level 1 and 2 all girl teams already do double or single based stunts to increase difficulty so there really isn't that much of a change.

 

[njallday]

Am I the only one who thinks that having 4 MEN on a LEVEL 2 team is just unfair!! I'm not a sore sport by any means, and I can see one or 2 males at level 2 and under not being considered c0-ed. BUT 4???? I have watched this same team win over and over against much better teams that just can not get their tumbling, basket and stunt scores as high. Not with a man in every single stunt. And then to see that EXACT same team go for Senior Level 3 Co-Ed!?? Its just so frustrating. The judges can only do their job legally and they do, but why does the USASF care more about glitter make up and how much your belly shows, than this issue?!! If anyone can explain to me, I really appreciate it.​

umm unless you're in another country, they aren't men, they're boys who are under 18. and most (but certainly not all) junior and below boys haven't hit puberty yet. senior boys could be an advantage but in junior and youth I wouldn't worry about it making a huge difference.

 

[BeFIERCE365]

Coming from a coach who has had a few experiences with boys on level2 teams, they honestly do not make or break a team. I've had 3 boys on a team of 22 at one time and honestly did not have a substantial advantage over other teams. Now if the team is half boys, that's one thing, but that's not been the case. We've gone up against teams with more boys than us and won, we've also lost to all girl teams before. I think it's more preparation and difficulty of the routine than anything else and the boys simple strength has not been as big of a difference because the stunts at level 2 are at the half level and thus not that complex. I definitely agree with the level3 and up being coed because extended stunts require much more strength and the boys provide an advantage there.

 

[cyngirl]

I see and appreciate all above sides, but this particular team is a Senior team, and then to watch that SAME exact team compete and hour later as Senior 3 Co-Ed, does get frustrating. I do feel that in the Senior Small Level 2 with having a least one male in each stunt it is an advantage. Basket tosses are absolutely higher, tumbling is definitely stronger, and single based stunts are much stronger - no bobbles and your choice of flyers is also expanded. You know how sometimes you have the small girl with ZERO flexibility and that stronger muscular girl with awesome flexibility but no one to lift her. Really not a problem - with at least one male for each stunt.
On the flip side of that I do agree that more division splits are not needed!
Thanks for all the input!:cheering:

 

[cyngirl]

I will agree with this. I think the lack of distinction only applies when having a boy really isn't a substantial advantage. At level 1-3, younger than juniors, i dint really think it is an advantage. However, starting at the junior age bracket, and definitely in level 4 stunting having boys IS an advantage. My son is 14 (last year of junior eligibility) is 6-1 and 150lbs and can toss to hands with senior flyers... He can toss extension with the smaller junior ones. Now it's not in our routine (which I wish it were) but there aren't a lot of AG teams out there that can do that. I would imagine my son is not the only junior 4 that can. There are two of them that can do that on his team. I imagine if you had four or five.... That's a huge advantage over an AG team.

umm unless you're in another country, they aren't men, they're boys who are under 18. and most (but certainly not all) junior and below boys haven't hit puberty yet. senior boys could be an advantage but in junior and youth I wouldn't worry about it making a huge difference.

I probably should have clarified that this is a Senior team I am referring to, where the cut off is still 18 as of 8/31. So they can easily turn 19 during the season and I promise you these males - are pretty darn close to men. lol