All-Star Gym Owners Refusing To Sign Release... Appeal Process?..

[quitthedrama]

What about a gym that drops a level. You compete level 5 first competition to lock the kids into your gym then drop to level 4 at the next competition? Now you are either sandbagging level 4 or just trying to hold on to kids the few level 5 kids you have that you know would have left if you told them from the beginning that you did not have the numbers to make a level 5.

And this is exactly why there should be exceptions to the rule. If the rule was to protect the gym from gym-hoppers and thus protect their Worlds team(s), then revise the wording to allow an athlete to leave when there is no longer an opportunity to attend World's with that gym. Keep the provision that balances must be paid, conduct must be upheld, etc. But as soon as a gym owner decides to drop their level 5 team to a level 4 or to disband a program or to not attend Worlds, there is no reason why an athlete in good standing should be held back from an opportunity to go to Worlds with another gym. If one kid gets screwed from the rule as it currently stands, that is one too many.

 

[Hi-Phlyer21]

After having read through this whole thread here's my stance on the subject.
1: I completely agree with Rudags

The purpose of this rule is to prevent gym hopping and especially in instances where an athlete is not in good standing with their primary organization

If you move to another program fine, that's your prerogative, but to speak ill of your primary program after the fact and manipulate the situation in an attempt to get what you want. Maintain a level of professionalism. You will warn much more respect that way.
Also the way I see it most programs have try-out between may (just before worlds) and end of April early may. From that point you have all of June, July/ August (about a month and a half/ two months)when you get choreography and then 'til about mid September or October when competition season is in full swing. That's 6/7 months BEFORE you begin competing. In that time, IMHO, one knows whether or not (s)he is happy at a program or with ones team placement at a program. And during that time one is welcome to leave if they feel that is the best course of action. That's not to say that one can not quit mid season, BUT this rule is far from new. While I I ow it can be difficult to understand the specifics at times I feel that most if not all parties involved are aware and if one is not then someone should have been doing their homework. To become involved in something not knowing the rules is not a course of action I would advise for anyone. You know what the governing body of your sport is. And all rules are outline and can be found on that go earning bodies website.
There is a general list, safety rules by level, rules exclusive to worlds ( and therefore worlds athletes) and anything you could possibly need to know.
If one doesn't take the time to be sure of what they are getting into then one has no other person to blame for the situation they are left in but themselves. Plain and simple.
Worlds is an HONOR and a PRIVILEGE. One does not simply get to go because they want to or because one is a member on an eligible team. That's why we have the BID PROCESS. You have to EARN it. Plain and simple.

As coaches and mentors aside from the actual competitive aspect of the sport it is our job to teach these kids valuable life lessons and responsibility. When you really get down to t that's what we're doing. They learn hard work, they learn to work with others as a team, they learn to face their fears with their heads held high, they learn that if you truly want something you fight for it and work til you have it they learn that success doesn't always mean winning, and they learn what it means to make commitment to something.

Back to what I was saying earlier the summer training season is plenty of time to decide if you like where you are before becoming fully committed. As parents you should be holding your children responsible for their actions. They made a commitment to x gym then they will finish the season at x gym and if the need to move is still an issue, then next season do as you will. If the safety of your child or another is the issue then that should be brought up to those in charge and if nothing is done to correct it then you may leave, but just know that you still made that commitment and you will be held to it. So whether you stay or go you will be held accountable.
It's a different story if a child moves out of the area or a gym closes or anything of the sort. In that respect there should be an appeals process, but the vast majority of those wishing to be released are not in that situation. They just can't let go and get over their own egos.
For those who think this rule does not protect your child it does nothing but and it is one of very few enforceable rules. I feel like when it comes to this people have that whole sense of entitlement.
Get over yourself. No one is entitled to anything and no one deserves anything. You earn it. You work for what you want. Jumping ship to go somewhere that has already earned their place without you.... Well there's no pride in that now is there. "I worked all of one week switching gyms so I could go to worlds" sorry not happening. AND this team you just joined has to go out and get a new bid because of it.
On that note as a gym owner or coach I would never want to take an athlete like that mid season. You left your primary gym because of what? How do I know you won't turn around and do the same thing here. Not taking the chance on some random new Susie when the 20 that have been here working, committed and dedicated the whole time will pay the price in the end. There are valid arguments for both sides. But in the whole it is usually the athlete that's in the wrong in this situation and consumed with their ego can not accept that.
I hope I stayed on track with this post. But that's just some of the things I think when I read the next new thread about releasing a child that pops up every other...
Many gyms do not and will not release athletes. As long as the reasons are just, it might not be your cup of tea, but... Suck it up. Life goes on.
Take it for what it is and use it to grow as an individual. Learn.i swear every time one of these threads pops up I just feel like ".......this again.... Why is Susie in so deserving of his/ her realease mr./ mrs. Susie. Please enlighten me and keep the BS to yourself. Thanks. "
Growing up there are a lot of things people won't like or agree with and sometimes it just is what it is.
Lets not teach our kids to be disrespectful or self-centered brats who think they can get whatever they want just by b!tching about we. We all know that we all hate that person. It's like when I see a child yelling at their parents in the gym or at competition. I. Would. Never... Allow such a thing. And the fact that it still happens makes them think they can do as they please and nothing will come of it. WRONG. Sorry Susie, but you're in for a bit of a reality check.

 

[Deleted member 11300]

Heres an idea. Gym owners come up with their own Release Agreement. After the teams have been put together, there can be a meeting with the team parents. They can go over the release rules. It can be as specific as needed:

If the team level drops, blah blah
If I put your CP on a lower level team, blah blah
If your CP loses skills to be on team, blah blah
If parent or CP talks trash about gym on social media, blah blah
If you dont pay on time, blah blah
If you think Im a witch, blah blah
If you think I don't care about your CP's safety, blah blah
If you think this team is going to suck and the gym down the street has room on a better team, blah blah

You get the idea. The owner tells the parents they have until a certain date to leave. After that time, they have to adhere by the release agreement. The owner signs, the parents signs, heck get it notarized. Make 5 copies. Whatever. That way, everyone is on the same page.

 

[Valvalmom]

After having read through this whole thread here's my stance on the subject.
1: I completely agree with Rudags

The purpose of this rule is to prevent gym hopping and especially in instances where an athlete is not in good standing with their primary organization

If you move to another program fine, that's your prerogative, but to speak ill of your primary program after the fact and manipulate the situation in an attempt to get what you want. Maintain a level of professionalism. You will warn much more respect that way.
Also the way I see it most programs have try-out between may (just before worlds) and end of April early may. From that point you have all of June, July/ August (about a month and a half/ two months)when you get choreography and then 'til about mid September or October when competition season is in full swing. That's 6/7 months BEFORE you begin competing. In that time, IMHO, one knows whether or not (s)he is happy at a program or with ones team placement at a program. And during that time one is welcome to leave if they feel that is the best course of action. That's not to say that one can not quit mid season, BUT this rule is far from new. While I I ow it can be difficult to understand the specifics at times I feel that most if not all parties involved are aware and if one is not then someone should have been doing their homework. To become involved in something not knowing the rules is not a course of action I would advise for anyone. You know what the governing body of your sport is. And all rules are outline and can be found on that go earning bodies website.
There is a general list, safety rules by level, rules exclusive to worlds ( and therefore worlds athletes) and anything you could possibly need to know.
If one doesn't take the time to be sure of what they are getting into then one has no other person to blame for the situation they are left in but themselves. Plain and simple.
Worlds is an HONOR and a PRIVILEGE. One does not simply get to go because they want to or because one is a member on an eligible team. That's why we have the BID PROCESS. You have to EARN it. Plain and simple.

As coaches and mentors aside from the actual competitive aspect of the sport it is our job to teach these kids valuable life lessons and responsibility. When you really get down to t that's what we're doing. They learn hard work, they learn to work with others as a team, they learn to face their fears with their heads held high, they learn that if you truly want something you fight for it and work til you have it they learn that success doesn't always mean winning, and they learn what it means to make commitment to something.

Back to what I was saying earlier the summer training season is plenty of time to decide if you like where you are before becoming fully committed. As parents you should be holding your children responsible for their actions. They made a commitment to x gym then they will finish the season at x gym and if the need to move is still an issue, then next season do as you will. If the safety of your child or another is the issue then that should be brought up to those in charge and if nothing is done to correct it then you may leave, but just know that you still made that commitment and you will be held to it. So whether you stay or go you will be held accountable.
It's a different story if a child moves out of the area or a gym closes or anything of the sort. In that respect there should be an appeals process, but the vast majority of those wishing to be released are not in that situation. They just can't let go and get over their own egos.
For those who think this rule does not protect your child it does nothing but and it is one of very few enforceable rules. I feel like when it comes to this people have that whole sense of entitlement.
Get over yourself. No one is entitled to anything and no one deserves anything. You earn it. You work for what you want. Jumping ship to go somewhere that has already earned their place without you.... Well there's no pride in that now is there. "I worked all of one week switching gyms so I could go to worlds" sorry not happening. AND this team you just joined has to go out and get a new bid because of it.
On that note as a gym owner or coach I would never want to take an athlete like that mid season. You left your primary gym because of what? How do I know you won't turn around and do the same thing here. Not taking the chance on some random new Susie when the 20 that have been here working, committed and dedicated the whole time will pay the price in the end. There are valid arguments for both sides. But in the whole it is usually the athlete that's in the wrong in this situation and consumed with their ego can not accept that.
I hope I stayed on track with this post. But that's just some of the things I think when I read the next new thread about releasing a child that pops up every other...
Many gyms do not and will not release athletes. As long as the reasons are just, it might not be your cup of tea, but... Suck it up. Life goes on.
Take it for what it is and use it to grow as an individual. Learn.i swear every time one of these threads pops up I just feel like ".......this again.... Why is Susie in so deserving of his/ her realease mr./ mrs. Susie. Please enlighten me and keep the BS to yourself. Thanks. "
Growing up there are a lot of things people won't like or agree with and sometimes it just is what it is.
Lets not teach our kids to be disrespectful or self-centered brats who think they can get whatever they want just by b!tching about we. We all know that we all hate that person. It's like when I see a child yelling at their parents in the gym or at competition. I. Would. Never... Allow such a thing. And the fact that it still happens makes them think they can do as they please and nothing will come of it. WRONG. Sorry Susie, but you're in for a bit of a reality check.

Ditto ditto ditto. Well said. The only thing I have to add is that I have seen gyms recruit kids shortly before worlds. "What? Your gym didn't get a bid? Commit to our gym for next season, and we will take you to worlds this year on suchandsuch team..." It's so wrong!

 

[Hi-Phlyer21]

Ditto ditto ditto. Well said. The only thing I have to add is that I have seen gyms recruit kids shortly before worlds. "What? Your gym didn't get a bid? Commit to our gym for next season, and we will take you to worlds this year on suchandsuch team..." It's so wrong!

Absolutely. Not to mention that that child should not be on the floor with that team as the rules for both alternates and substitutions require that in both instances the alternate/ sub was a registered member of the gym prior to receiving the bid.
But it seems that many people don't bring up when they see illegal athletes on the floor at worlds. Or at least I haven't seen it happen. It may happen more than I am aware of.
I mean, if the family was going to leave. Then they're more than likely leaving regardless. But sometimes there can be a change of heart or things get worked out but the point is that doesn't mean you aren't responsible for what you've started. If you can't finish it don't get involved in it I say.

 

[shadow]

Hi-Phlyer21 TLDR You lost all credibility with "Get over yourself".

 

[Hi-Phlyer21]

Oh, and I would also like to add that you don't pay to be level 5. You pay to be trained.
Correct me of I'm wrong but senior 5 pays the same tuition and competition fees as senior 2/3/4 at most programs (I know some charge a slight but more to the worlds teams)...
So whether your team decides to make changes of some kind with regard to level or division or whatever the case may be. You are still getting what you are paying for.
The fact is you just WANT to be paying for it in a different way/ at a different level or whatever the case may be in the given situation.
People need to keep that in mind as well...

 

[Hi-Phlyer21]

Hi-Phlyer21 TLDR You lost all credibility with "Get over yourself".

Well then so be it. I said what I had to say to make my point.
Fact is that my opinion in many, but not all, cases of gym release it seems that the egos of those involved get the better of them. That's all. If me saying "get over yourself" takes away from my credibility is not my concern. Perhaps you would rather I said " one must learn to put the egos aside"?
Regardless of my choice of words. My point is still clear.

That's all.

 

[shadow]

Well then so be it. I said what I had to say to make my point.
Fact is that my opinion in many, but not all, cases of gym release it seems that the egos of those involved get the better of them. That's all. If me saying "get over yourself" takes away from my credibility is not my concern. Perhaps you would rather I said " one must learn to put the egos aside"?
Regardless of my choice of words. My point is still clear.

That's all.

There were so many grammatical errors I honestly could not follow it. It was anything but clear. The only thing I got out of it was that the gym you are coaching with won't sign a waiver and you are justifying it? Is that correct?

 

[Mom2Cheergirls]

Not a perfect system, but at least the major crop of athletes would be covered. Level 4 athletes could be covered as well seeing as they're close. Hypothetically, this was supposed to cover all athletes soon/all athletes will need to be registered eventually, so it would be for everyone.

I wold think it would apply for The Summit then in the future??? if not now?? Totally a question not sure asking you all my experts

 

[Hi-Phlyer21]

There were so many grammatical errors I honestly could not follow it. It was anything but clear. The only thing I got out of it was that the gym you are coaching with won't sign a waiver and you are justifying it? Is that correct?

I said nothing about the gym I coach with and I don't see how the gym I coach with has anything to do with this discussion.
In short I said that I feel as though these threads about releasing x child from x gym that pop up every month are beginning to get a bit tawdry.
I feel as though not much is done other than long list of complaints and acting out on various social media websites.
I can also understand both sides of the argument, but I do feel that this rule is doing exactly what was intended and protects both gym owners and athletes to an extent. However there should be a some sort of appeals process for the rare (or maybe not so rare) situation where say a gym closes its doors or a family relocates during the season.
It also seems to me that people tend to out this all on the gym owners and put no responsibility in the hands of the athlete or the athletes family; exactly like the earlier comment about parents yelling at a teacher when their child's performance in school isn't up to par.
IMHO there is a large enough window between try-outs and competition season where one is able to decide if they would like to remain where they are. I understand that things can change throughout the year and that's fine, but when a commitment is made it should be honored unless either party is left unable to do so.
The athletes and their families need to share the responsibility on this matter rather than what would seem like most people putting it all on the gym owners.

I have said what I felt needed to be said and will have no further involvement on this topic. That's all there is to it.

I hope that anyone involved in situations such as this can resolved find a way to relative them or at least gain a better understanding so that thy learn from it and in the future they are better prepared to handle the possibility of what can come from this.

 

[Deleted member 15]

I wold think it would apply for The Summit then in the future??? if not now?? Totally a question not sure asking you all my experts

USASF doesn't run the Summit so it won't be exactly the same, but Varsity could implement something similar.

 

[CricketCheerMom]

I'm just curious but has anyone been released this season? It seems that this rule has backfired in that it is allowing very spiteful gym owners to take their anger out on children. I honestly have not heard or seen one instance where it's been used the way it was intended...keeping Worlds athletes from gym hopping.

I don't know anyone who was released this season. they ended up going to a non-worlds team. Down the line if the Summit becomes a big thing is this going to apply at all ages.

I love this saying from a mom above because it is so so true....
And as for what they say.... In my cheer mom career. I've been sold so much oceanfront property in Kansas that my water wings double as sandbags.

I don't believe what anyone says and if you don't drink the Kool Aid, you are not a team player.

What scares me but also makes me skeptical is that a gym of 600 athletes is what you consider unsafe?! What is your definition of unsafe. A gym of 100 kids, I can see enough Mom's drink the Kool Aid with a little vodka mixed in but 600?

 

[shadow]

USASF doesn't run the Summit so it won't be exactly the same, but Varsity could implement something similar.

It is important to keep the dialog going. As you read through the numerous threads on this topic you realize that there needs to be a better system that protects both the athlete and the gym.

 

[blunchin]

i will never be a fan of this rule...ever