All-Star From Courtney Pope - "the View From Backstage At The Naccc..."

[just_kay_today]

There are many parents at CAC and CEA that know each other well. Kids have gone to CEA for opportunities that CAC can't provide. We have kids that return for their own personal reasons. Many of us are close friends and we discuss our gym's philosophies quite often. Here are a few points I'd like to make.

• Many kids CAC with full/double skills go to CEA. In addition many other gyms in NC lose kids to CEA because of opportunites they can't provide. This is s business and CEA can provide a service that others cannot. However most know in NC that if CEA loses Youth 5 then they lose a huge opportunity to attract elite youth talent. CEA is not the only gym that can teach proper tumbling but they are the only one that has 5(?) locations, 800 athletes, and a lot of smaller sized well-coached gyms within a 3 hour drive to Kenersville to pull 36 Elite kids from. CEA is far from the only gym in NC that can teach "proper" tumbling. Again, this is not explained as a fault but as an opportunity that CEA has been able to wisely use to their advantage.
• The campaign here in NC to "Save Youth 5" is crazy right now. Emails and text messaged are flying back and forth about how WC is trying to ruin Youth Elite. Invitations were everywhere inviting anyone(from any gym) that cares about the division to come on by and be a part of a video to "Save Youth 5". The joke in the state right now is "Do they ask our kids to throw their best tumbling pass when you go also?"
• Junior aged parents are now being warned that if Youth 5 is eliminated then the junior flyers will be coming out of the air to make room for the youthies. Stage 2 hysteria began.
• A last minute effort was made to take Youth Elite to Jamfest to prove that Y5 isn't dead by having 3 teams there. Last I heard the parents didn't want to do it. Go figure...a costly last minute trip to Indy from NC in the middle of an already hectic Nationals season.
• Courtney knows how to work the cheer system like no other. I am constantly amazed at what she comes up with and I have no doubt she'd do anything for her kids.

I mention all these things NOT because they are wrong. It's actually very smart business, This is what CEA needs to do to save the division and one of the doors they use to attract new talent. However, to have Courtney call out the industry for manipulation and behind the scenes tactics is kind of like the pot calling the kettle black isn't it?


Maybe WC started this. Maybe they are scared of competing against CEA. I don't personally believe it but that's worth about as much as my opinion on the rest of it. Last I heard though, every member gets a vote and I highly doubt that even Elaine's powers of pursuasion can convince every coach in the USASF to vote against Youth 5 if they didn't already feel it was the right thing to do.

Wow...can you sound any more biased? Having had a child on a Youth Level 5 team, my desire to see the divison survive and thrive are based on my experiences and the experiences of my child. I don't care who works what system. I don't care about the politics involved. I do care about the children who I've watched grow not only in skill, but in maturity and self-esteem by being able to perform at their highest level. Children, like my own. I am sure that the parents of the kids who cheered on CAC's youth 5 program have their own fond memories of their time there and can attest to the benefits of the division. Yes, I remember when CAC had a Y5 program of their own. Those kids went on to make Teal what it is reputed to be today. I don't know if your daughter was on that team, but surely if she was, she benefitted.

Please refrain speaking as though you have inside knowledge of what goes on in our program. I had lunch with Courtney yesterday and at no time did she mention having to turn away kids. Her concern was for the effect this change would have on the kids, and on the industry as a whole, in the long run. Also, she never warned me that my daughter would have to fly baby flyers on juniors next season. You're just wrong.

By the way: If your calculations are correct, CEA's 5 (?) gyms and 900+ athletes mean that if Y5 died, CEA could just field more excellent Jr 5 teams. This just means more of our teams, at more competitions. CEA would then have an even stronger presence, locally, attending many of the comps you attend now, that we currently don't. By the tone of your comment, I am sure you'd be thrilled.

 

[Drkilluzionz]

Edited b/c the more I read through this post and the original posting I just want nothing to do with it.

 

[xtremeteal4life]

Umm.. Actually that was posted on his wall in a comment she made on his "save youth 5..." post. And if you read my edited post it I did correct myself to say "New Jersey Friends" instead of WC in that reference. However, she did specifically talk about world cup out in her second posting in this forum.

I apologize for missing your edited post...but as far as the comment, I'm assuming your his fb friend so could you please show me where, bc unless I'm blind or overly sleep deprived it is not posted on his wall

 

[xtremeteal4life]

Wow...can you sound any more biased? Having had a child on a Youth Level 5 team, my desire to see the divison survive and thrive are based on my experiences and the experiences of my child. I don't care who works what system. I don't care about the politics involved. I do care about the children who I've watched grow not only in skill, but in maturity and self-esteem by being able to perform at their highest level. Children, like my own. I am sure that the parents of the kids who cheered on CAC's youth 5 program have their own fond memories of their time there and can attest to the benefits of the division. Yes, I remember when CAC had a Y5 program of their own. Those kids went on to make Teal what it is reputed to be today. I don't know if your daughter was on that team, but surely if she was, she benefitted.

Please refrain speaking as though you have inside knowledge of what goes on in our program. I had lunch with Courtney yesterday and at no time did she mention having to turn away kids. Her concern was for the effect this change would have on the kids, and on the industry as a whole, in the long run. Also, she never warned me that my daughter would have to fly baby flyers on juniors next season. You're just wrong.

By the way: If your calculations are correct, CEA's 5 (?) gyms and 900+ athletes mean that if Y5 died, CEA could just field more excellent Jr 5 teams. This just means more of our teams, at more competitions. CEA would then have an even stronger presence, locally, attending many of the comps you attend now, that we currently don't. By the tone of your comment, I am sure you'd be thrilled.

I think there are 6
Kernersville
Salem
LKN
Sanford
Raleigh
Greenville

 

[Mo-Lissa]

I totally respect each and everyone of these L5 youth age kids, I wish my daughter would have had a chance to be on a Y or J Level 5 team from any one of the big name gyms. Unfortunately, not available to us where I live. But after reading, ALL these posts.... I start to question do all 6 of the CEA gyms have Y5 teams, or they pull the best 36 Y L5 kids from all locations to make this dynasty team. That is where the question of fairness bothers me the most, it seems more like the best in the state team verses local gym team. I myself and my daughter have MANY friends at CEA, so I am not trying to bash anyone!!! Also, all the other Y5 teams out there could be doing the same thing.....I personally do not know. If my gym could pull the best 36 Y5 kids from a 200 mile radius, we could more than likely have a banging Y L5 team. YES...I could choose to drive the 2 to 3 hours for this experience, and did try it one year, but felt my child needed to represent her city and we absolutely love our coaches here. But just for arguments sake, if my cp represented her city on the best level we offer here SO5, and then I drove her to be on the closest team true to her level which now is J5, it is not well received in the industry. I really think need we need to take ALL this into consideration. Long live Y5 or restricted Y5 nothing better than young kids with awesome talent!!!!!!!

 

[SharkDad]

I don't know about that...I see Senior Open 5 kids throughout the country striving to perfect their skills out of just wanting to be the best they can or in hopes of being on a World's eligible or non-restrictive team the following season.

There are dedicated kids in every program all over the country. I was talking about these youth elite kids

 

[notimeforthat]

I totally respect each and everyone of these L5 youth age kids, I wish my daughter would have had a chance to be on a Y or J Level 5 team from any one of the big name gyms. Unfortunately, not available to us where I live. But after reading, ALL these posts.... I start to question do all 6 of the CEA gyms have Y5 teams, or they pull the best 36 Y L5 kids from all locations to make this dynasty team. That is where the question of fairness bothers me the most, it seems more like the best in the state team verses local gym team. I myself and my daughter have MANY friends at CEA, so I am not trying to bash anyone!!! Also, all the other Y5 teams out there could be doing the same thing.....I personally do not know. If my gym could pull the best 36 Y5 kids from a 200 mile radius, we could more than likely have a banging Y L5 team. YES...I could choose to drive the 2 to 3 hours for this experience, and did try it one year, but felt my child needed to represent her city and we absolutely love our coaches here. But just for arguments sake, if my cp represented her city on the best level we offer here SO5, and then I drove her to be on the closest team true to her level which now is J5, it is not well received in the industry. I really think need we need to take ALL this into consideration. Long live Y5 or restricted Y5 nothing better than young kids with awesome talent!!!!!!!

cheer extreme has only one y5 team.

 

[SharkDad]

I totally respect each and everyone of these L5 youth age kids, I wish my daughter would have had a chance to be on a Y or J Level 5 team from any one of the big name gyms. Unfortunately, not available to us where I live. But after reading, ALL these posts.... I start to question do all 6 of the CEA gyms have Y5 teams, or they pull the best 36 Y L5 kids from all locations to make this dynasty team. That is where the question of fairness bothers me the most, it seems more like the best in the state team verses local gym team. I myself and my daughter have MANY friends at CEA, so I am not trying to bash anyone!!! Also, all the other Y5 teams out there could be doing the same thing.....I personally do not know. If my gym could pull the best 36 Y5 kids from a 200 mile radius, we could more than likely have a banging Y L5 team. YES...I could choose to drive the 2 to 3 hours for this experience, and did try it one year, but felt my child needed to represent her city and we absolutely love our coaches here. But just for arguments sake, if my cp represented her city on the best level we offer here SO5, and then I drove her to be on the closest team true to her level which now is J5, it is not well received in the industry. I really think need we need to take ALL this into consideration. Long live Y5 or restricted Y5 nothing better than young kids with awesome talent!!!!!!!

Thank you so much for posting that! You have the option to leave a small gym and choose not too because you care about your gym. That is because you believe in them and they show you they care about you. I know your program and I'm glad it's doing well.

All small gyms have the option to grow and become big gyms like CEA did. There were many gyms in the state when CEA started out. ( yes I know they weren't as big as CEA is now)

To my knowledge Kernersville is the only gym with a Youth L5 right now. The majority of the kids are from that area but a few are not. There are kids in all of the gyms working those skills, though, and when there are enough at, say, the Raleigh gym then I would guess they will form another team. Again. . .if presented well, goal oriented, with lots of love and professionalism toward the kids and parents any gym can work to create younger high skilled athletes.

 

[StarshipTrooper]

I totally respect each and everyone of these L5 youth age kids, I wish my daughter would have had a chance to be on a Y or J Level 5 team from any one of the big name gyms. Unfortunately, not available to us where I live. But after reading, ALL these posts.... I start to question do all 6 of the CEA gyms have Y5 teams, or they pull the best 36 Y L5 kids from all locations to make this dynasty team. That is where the question of fairness bothers me the most, it seems more like the best in the state team verses local gym team. I myself and my daughter have MANY friends at CEA, so I am not trying to bash anyone!!! Also, all the other Y5 teams out there could be doing the same thing.....I personally do not know. If my gym could pull the best 36 Y5 kids from a 200 mile radius, we could more than likely have a banging Y L5 team. YES...I could choose to drive the 2 to 3 hours for this experience, and did try it one year, but felt my child needed to represent her city and we absolutely love our coaches here. But just for arguments sake, if my cp represented her city on the best level we offer here SO5, and then I drove her to be on the closest team true to her level which now is J5, it is not well received in the industry. I really think need we need to take ALL this into consideration. Long live Y5 or restricted Y5 nothing better than young kids with awesome talent!!!!!!!

This is an unauthorized post and only represents my opinion and perceptions. It is meant to inform from my pov and not be a statement of the opinions of anyone else.

I think to your great credit you are getting to the point of where some of the basic "disagreements" live and create "problems". Some history. 12 years ago we were thinking about going to CEA from a smaller gym in the area as Courtney appeared to be a dynamic and talented coach. We were right. When we joined with girls ages 5 and 7, the CEA teams had very stiff regional competition at Charlotte, Greensboro and Raleigh. Good and successful programs. She wanted to create teams that could compete with these gyms with the philosophy that if you can win, the athletes may tend to gravitate towards your gym. Good idea, and it seemed to work to some extent, but most of the kids CEA got in those years were NOT from the existing gyms, the transfers were few and far between. The new kids were new to cheer, that saw CEA teams at local exhibitions at malls, local school events and the like. Courtney grew her gym through hard work. I was there and rolled some mats in parking lots and Jr High gyms more than I like to remember. That said, as we became more successful the staff, athletes and parents wanted to compete on a larger stage and made the gym wide committment to win an NCA jacket. That was the Holy Grail. Only CAC had done that from our area, with their Large Senior All Girl team and one of our coaches now, Sarah was on that great CAC team that was an inspiration to us early on. They had done what we all wanted to duplicate. But some in the the gym had been to NCA enough times, sometimes making finals but never seriously threatening to win against the powerhouse gyms, and Cheer Athletics was the dominate gym at NCA (still is I suppose along with Stingrays). That experience convinced the staff that to compete with teams in large population centers like Dallas where cheer was king and more athletes available in smaller geographic areas, we would have to widened our geographic draw to get the athletes to have any hope of ever winning NCA. However, as with virtually everyone else in the industry past and present, we were trying to build a program that could compete with and possiblby beat CA. That gym is amazing to my way of thinking, as they have been everyone's target since the very first day, and only with the rise of Worlds has winning NCA gone from being the biggest price by far to on par with Worlds.

So I opened the first CEA satellite gym in our small town about 45 miles from Kernersville in 2001. It kept about 75 to 100 kids participating at the lower levels, we did have a youth and junior level 4 team, but of those 75 kids, about 15 to the "cheer bug" and joined the higher level teams in Kernersville to compete more on a national level. Interestingly, the team that first won NCA in 2005, Junior Large All Girls had about 10 of these kids that were key members of that team the actually "found the Grail" and 5 of them were flyers. This from a town of 7 thousand. And Courtney and Ben were there running practice in Kernersville, Mount Airy, thne Wintson-Salem. They worked and continue to work very, very hard at their career. At that time and to this day, the vast majority of the Kernersville cheerleaders are "grown and developed" in the parent gym and the satellites. However, on SE especially there has recently been a block of kids from Raliegh and more recently Charlotte that have been very, very important to our success. But this has been basically since we began trying to win Worlds. There may be a perception that the Kernersville teams comb the area to get the best athletes out of other gyms to for "national teams" but I don't think the statistics would show that at all. The vast majority of kids you see on CEA teams are CEA developed athletes.

Now, back to your point. The more traditional concept of a gym would likely be one location that draws from the area, maybe easy driving distance, and competes with the kids that show up at tryouts or walk in the door may be more appealing to many. But their committment (Ben and Courtney) to give the kids in central NC an opportunity to compete with and win World and National competitions against the very best teams was with a business model that is both non traditional and totally driven by the population and access to highly talented athletes in Peidmont NC. It requires a central gym, now two with Raleigh and possibley more like Greenville, with the satellite gyms. It may not seem fair, but the local satellite teams and even the Kernersville teams are very much able to be competed with and beaten by all the local gyms that want to put a team on the mat. In the Level 5 area, we do have advantages against smaller local gyms, but the role of these teams is to give an opportunitiy for the highly talented and committed level 5 athlete in our area to compete on a national and world level and have a good chance at winning. AND to create the teams and numbers to support the whole gym concept. They have done that, not to punish local gyms, but to be a national presence AND to be successful in their personal lives. Their success creates some pushback, that is understandable. I think it is probably a moot point, as whatever the outcome, there will still be Youth 5 and the big gyms with the most access to high quality athletes will continue to dominate those divisions. And the kids and parents that want that experience, and after 12 years I can tell you it has been a great ride for us and our girls, will continue to gravitate to the opportunity. I think it is both fair and good business.

 

[just_kay_today]

I totally respect each and everyone of these L5 youth age kids, I wish my daughter would have had a chance to be on a Y or J Level 5 team from any one of the big name gyms. Unfortunately, not available to us where I live. But after reading, ALL these posts.... I start to question do all 6 of the CEA gyms have Y5 teams, or they pull the best 36 Y L5 kids from all locations to make this dynasty team. That is where the question of fairness bothers me the most, it seems more like the best in the state team verses local gym team. I myself and my daughter have MANY friends at CEA, so I am not trying to bash anyone!!! Also, all the other Y5 teams out there could be doing the same thing.....I personally do not know. If my gym could pull the best 36 Y5 kids from a 200 mile radius, we could more than likely have a banging Y L5 team. YES...I could choose to drive the 2 to 3 hours for this experience, and did try it one year, but felt my child needed to represent her city and we absolutely love our coaches here. But just for arguments sake, if my cp represented her city on the best level we offer here SO5, and then I drove her to be on the closest team true to her level which now is J5, it is not well received in the industry. I really think need we need to take ALL this into consideration. Long live Y5 or restricted Y5 nothing better than young kids with awesome talent!!!!!!!

CEA has had a Y5 program, before there was "Youth 5". Back then it was call Youth Advanced. Many of those kids are on Senior Elite now. There were many years where their talent did not match the more venerable programs...like Charlotte and WC. But, what I respect is that they kept losing, kept learning, and eventually developed into what it is today. To answer your question, most of the kids on the team today are local kids who have been with CEA forever. Despite what folks say, kids are not "pulled" from anywhere. Parents choose to bring their kids to Kernersville for the opportunity to have them cheer for Courtney. As Shark Dad mentioned, there are youth aged, L5 athletes in Raleigh, whose parents choose not to make the drive. Since the Kernersville gym also houses a Mini 3 team, at the end of every season, there are kids who have developed the skills to make the move from Mini 3 to Youth L4 and possibly Youth L5.

For your pleasure: Here's a video of CAC and CEA Youth Large advance teams from 04-05: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FimzBwNzByA&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

 

[Mo-Lissa]

CEA has had a Y5 program, before there was "Youth 5". Back then it was call Youth Advanced. Many of those kids are on Senior Elite now. There were many years where their talent did not match the more venerable programs...like Charlotte and WC. But, what I respect is that they kept losing, kept learning, and eventually developed into what it is today. To answer your question, most of the kids on the team today are local kids who have been with CEA forever. Despite what folks say, kids are not "pulled" from anywhere. Parents choose to bring their kids to Kernersville for the opportunity to have them cheer for Courtney. As Shark Dad mentioned, there are youth aged, L5 athletes in Raleigh, whose parents choose not to make the drive. Since the Kernersville gym also houses a Mini 3 team, at the end of every season, there are kids who have developed the skills to make the move from Mini 3 to Youth L4 and possibly Youth L5.

For your pleasure: Here's a video of CAC and CEA Youth Large advance teams from 04-05: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FimzBwNzByA&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

Thank you for your post as my own daughter was on the Wilmington Allstars Youth Advanced, with some of the first youth age kids to have doubles. Several of those boys from our old gym, have cheered and even coach at CEA. One being Darnell Harris, who is with Louisville now. I have been in allstars for about 14 years. I have watched CEA grow and flourish through the years.....very impressive to boot!!! The kids are not "pulled", but who would want to be on a little small gym team, when you can be on a World Champion Team? I am just saying, I know of athletes that are on teams in Greenville, Raleigh, and Kernersville so is that really local??? I applaud CEA for what they have done to grow a business, this as stated was no way bashing. I just feel, maybe we should look at cross competing athletes, because I feel an athlete should belong to a location gym, not under a a huge umbrella named business. This is just my opinion.... Sorry to hi-jack thread!! BUT......I stand by, LONG LIVE Y5!!

 

[CA_kayla]

I think your assumption that the kids are leaving CAC because they want to join the Y5 team is totally inaccurate! All of those kids leave because they want to join CEA Period!!!! All of the kids that left are J5 eligible and if stayed at CAC would be on their J5 team, so why leave??

Also, you know that Courtney does not "recruit" kids from other Gyms, so making the "business card" statement is quite foolish.

 

[CharlotteASMom]

You might want to check my statement again...

Many kids CAC with full/double skills go to CEA. In addition many other gyms in NC lose kids to CEA because of opportunites they can't provide.

As far as the business card thing, I've said it twice now...it was a joke. Has Courtney ever given a business card to a CAC kid? Yes Is this good business? Yes If we or any other gym in NC can give a cheerleader what they want and need then they will stay. If not they will leave and we will wish then the best!

 

[CA_kayla]

You did also say, "you know how many kids leave CAC to go to CEA because we don't have a Youth 5 option".

Does that not mean CAC kids leave to join CEA's Y5 team?? Help me understanding.

 

[CharlotteASMom]

You did also say, "you know how many kids leave CAC to go to CEA because we don't have a Youth 5 option".

Does that not mean CAC kids leave to join CEA's Y5 team?? Help me understanding.

That's true I did say that.