All-Star Bangkok Winning

[njallday]

while the USASF may have quietly admitted a mistake.. there is quite a difference between accidentally making a scoring mistake and an intentional one. This is the second time this has happened. if you think it was just a scoring mistake, you're crazy. they hire the "best" judges in the industry. they know how to score and count just fine.

i'd also wager that if someone signing your paycheck asked you to make something happen, you would. just sayin'

 

[WinstonsGirl]

I felt a lot of the results in 6 were based on getting more international teams into the top 10, or higher placings. Bangkok is amazing, but they don't have the partner stunts to place that high. In IO 6, I firmly believe Flyers were placed third to avoid having 3 US teams in the to 3. After Viqueens bit it, it looked to be more likely, but the fall on Golden Girls left the door open. Don't get me wrong, I think Flyers are amazing, but having a newer team, they aren't the same team they were last year. I do believe they deserved 4th/5th, but third was to get more international teams in the rankings. I was also surprised by the top 10 rankings in both IO 6 and IOC 6 as there seemed to be some teams who hit clean but dropped significantly in placings to international teams. If both hit clean day 2 and 3, scores should be similar, not having team A beat team B by 20 points on day 2 and vice versa day 3.

This also comes too with no guidelines for a score sheet. Judges can basically give whatever score they want because there are no guidelines as to which skills rate which scores. I think it worked out well for teams like Flyers and Bangkok, but what about the teams who got the short end of the stick and got placed lower to make room for teams that maybe didn't deserve such a high placing. It would really suck for them.

 

[njallday]

the backspot gets me every time. how does she get up there? it's like "just push her and hope for the best..."

 

[andimdone]

the backspot gets me every time. how does she get up there? it's like "just push her and hope for the best..."

im dying hahahahahha

 

[Mr May]

I'm no rules judge but isn't that piece illegal as well? There's no front and back spot in place when she hits or am I crazy?

 

[Batch]

I'm no rules judge but isn't that piece illegal as well? There's no front and back spot in place when she hits or am I crazy?

Definitely illegal according to how I was trained by Les.
(But it would probably help if the USASF released the Level 6 rules earlier than late October and included the full Level 6 rule set in the safety judge training at the regional meetings... come on now)

 

[catlady]

You'd be surprised to find out how deep some are in contractually and financially.. some even receiving gym paychecks directly from the sources.
Vague I know, but for a reason. Keep your eyes open.

I know this may seem underhanded to you, but everything you stated is normal when you are providing capital to start up a business across the world or in other states. I give you money to start up a gym, buy a spring floor, provide training and payroll. In return, you may not go to any unapproved venues, start up any related businesses, merchandise, etc. The initials you stated are expanding overseas and across the country and they are providing start up capital. They are providing businesses, expanding cheer, providing more competition, and getting it out into the public eye. Are they controlling the way cheer is headed? Absolutely. Does anything they are doing surprise me from a business point of view? Absolutely not.

 

[catlady]

I know nothing about the Bangkok situation so I can't say anything worthwhile on that subject. With that said, everyone wants an even playing field, but no one is really admitting the playing field is not even close to being even. There are language barriers, economic and social differences, and lack of trained personnel and facilities in many of these countries. Affirmative action was put into place not as a permanent solution, but intended as a temporary solution until others were provided the schooling and opportunities to even out the playing field and provide a sense of hope. So ask yourself honestly, how do you entice other countries to fly across the world to participate in an International event at an expensive venue and follow your rules, when their version of cheer, if they had anything like it, did not follow the same rules and regulations? I'm not asking this sarcastically, I would really like to hear what some of your solutions would be to this obvious problem. Keep in mind the average family income in the US is $54,000, in Chile $11,500 (US) and in Jamaica $7400 (about the amount our family spent on All Star cheer last year with travel, tuition, and related merchandise). I can't even begin to come up with what I consider a fair resolution.

 

[Ashley]

Definitely illegal according to how I was trained by Les.
(But it would probably help if the USASF released the Level 6 rules earlier than late October and included the full Level 6 rule set in the safety judge training at the regional meetings... come on now)

At least they're credentialing level 6 this year!

 

[Ashley]

I know nothing about the Bangkok situation so I can't say anything worthwhile on that subject. With that said, everyone wants an even playing field, but no one is really admitting the playing field is not even close to being even. There are language barriers, economic and social differences, and lack of trained personnel and facilities in many of these countries. Affirmative action was put into place not as a permanent solution, but intended as a temporary solution until others were provided the schooling and opportunities to even out the playing field and provide a sense of hope. So ask yourself honestly, how do you entice other countries to fly across the world to participate in an International event at an expensive venue and follow your rules, when their version of cheer, if they had anything like it, did not follow the same rules and regulations? I'm not asking this sarcastically, I would really like to hear what some of your solutions would be to this obvious problem. Keep in mind the average family income in the US is $54,000, in Chile $11,500 (US) and in Jamaica $7400 (about the amount our family spent on All Star cheer last year with travel, tuition, and related merchandise). I can't even begin to come up with what I consider a fair resolution.

Top 3 teams from each country moving on to finals was supposed to be the affirmative action solution. It leaves a lot of talented US teams out of finals in favor of less talented international ones that traveled oh so far (except Canada, they're getting screwed too). But that doesn't mean we should be giving bonus points to teams who spent a lot of money to get here. Heck, IASF can give Bangkok a partial paid bid if they want them to come so bad. Or do some back door deal where they fund the trip. I don't care, as long as the top 3 teams are the teams that deserve to be at the top.

 

[Mr May]

Cat lady

So the resolution to inequality is to create more of it? I didn't start with cheer knowledge I sought out and found it. I wasn't born with any skill set I earned them. My family growing up was well below the median income that you posted, divorced etc. I did not wait to have things handed to me I created my own opportunities. The athletes on a level 6 team are generally very poor college students who do not have support from home anymore. Id argue most of them make far less than the lowest income you posted. But they fundraise, sell their own possessions even beg to get themselves there. We all have shortcomings and areas in which we have and show weakness. Bangkok a pyramids(illegal or not) are amazing and far better than ours. I didn't ask for a their pyramid score to be worth less on the score sheet nor was it offered.

As for knowing the rules etc, I would never go to another country and expect their rules to bend to my understanding. If I choose to play someone else's game I then have to abide by their rules.

 

[catlady]

Top 3 teams from each country moving on to finals was supposed to be the affirmative action solution. It leaves a lot of talented US teams out of finals in favor of less talented international ones that traveled oh so far (except Canada, they're getting screwed too). But that doesn't mean we should be giving bonus points to teams who spent a lot of money to get here. Heck, IASF can give Bangkok a partial paid bid if they want them to come so bad. Or do some back door deal where they fund the trip. I don't care, as long as the top 3 teams are the teams that deserve to be at the top.

As I said in my post, I can't and won't say anything on the Bangkok, it would be purely hearsay and irrelevant to benefiting the conversation. I am with you that there are a lot of talented teams that are not moving on. I, also, felt as though the top 3 teams from each country moving on to finals was supposed to be the "fair" solution, however, it has obviously upset many in the process. My question is simply, how do we keep this an International event and everyone happy in the process on the issue of being fair? I have nothing.

@Mr May You are actually preaching to the choir, I agree inequalities are always going to exist. BUT, my question is, if you truly want to have an International event, how do you get them over here year after year and everyone happy? That's all I'm asking. My opinion on Bangkok is solely, Bangkok is doing cheer the way Bangkok does cheer. I know this event is in our backyard, but do we have to take away the International flavor in the process? Maybe so, catlady has nothing, but I will be sad if all of our International teams end up looking the same.

 

[Mr May]

Nobody wants to take away their style or flare. Playing within the rules doesn't do that just within the United States so why would it take away from teams who only visit our style of cheer once every few years?

 

[UCFKnights07]

What's the point of calling it Worlds if people think that the international teams shouldn't make it past day one I can see why they have the rule in place. Even if it's unfair.

 

[Mom Jeans]

Top 3 teams from each country moving on to finals was supposed to be the affirmative action solution. It leaves a lot of talented US teams out of finals in favor of less talented international ones that traveled oh so far (except Canada, they're getting screwed too). But that doesn't mean we should be giving bonus points to teams who spent a lot of money to get here. Heck, IASF can give Bangkok a partial paid bid if they want them to come so bad. Or do some back door deal where they fund the trip. I don't care, as long as the top 3 teams are the teams that deserve to be at the top.

This! And I stated before, I think USASF has it backwords. Instead of US trials it should be International Trials and the International Cup, let all teams perform day 1 , top 10 from each country perform day 2 (which would be the same as it is now because only the US and Canada have more than 10) award The International Cup then top 10 no matter wher your you're from compete in finals.

Worlds is the only place our International kids get to perform against each other and the current process doesn't give an accurate picture of who is best. I don't like the whole theory about that's what the OLympics does, cuz we aren't the Olympics and that rule is for the Individual rounds, the team event goes by score. I can say the rule is fine for ICU