All-Star Discuss Your Usasf Struggles Here

[nowand4ever]

alright im gonna just come out and say it cause it drives me nuts. Do i agree that USASF are idiots for making those teams compete in those conditions, absolutely. But i cant stand poor sportsmanship, it really grinds my gears. CEA as whole needs to learn how to take a loss more graciously, the amount of garbage ive seen on social media is ridiculous, and i aint gonna lie i follow quite a bit of girls from the other large senior teams on twitter, but the majority of it has come out of cea and quite a bit out of stingrays.

ill always love an underdog win, so f5 winning is amazing, along with all the other teams that won worlds this year. The top teams arent always going to win worlds, people just need to start to realize this as worlds progress and more teams become more seasoned and experienced. The days of CEA, CA, TG, Stingrays always walking away with multiple wins in every division every year i think will slowly diminish as time goes on. Im not saying that these programs arent great, cause they are and always will be, but i cant see them dominating the divisions every year like they use to.

Just to clarify, SE is not upset we lost, we are upset that at least three rules were broken and ignored! Yes, we could sit back and just take our lose "quietly" but then that leaves the door open for usasf to continue to do whatever they want at the expense of our kids. It's just time to do what is right. Congrats to F5 for pulling it together and hitting better than the rest under these conditions. Their win was earned and nobody is arguing that they should not have won. My daughter immediately upon setting wiped her shoes off because they were wet. Nothing prepared her for what to do next but to "go on with the show" but I can tell you it's all she thought about for the next 2 1/2 minutes as she was competing her last performance. She was terrified trying to tumble on that Mat. She immediately went to her coaches irate that the conditions were unacceptable. We are thankful CSP and the rest of the CEA coaches care so much about their athletes! Win or lose not following the rules is not ok.

 

[cheersafety]

Has anyone contacted Kimberly Archie? I know she was on here at one point but she is literally the bulldog of cheer safety. I'm wondering if she has seen or heard any of this.
The fact of the matter is there is NOT ONE gym (except CSP because she really has nothing to lose at this point) that is going to take a stand. They haven't the last 3 years and I don't expect to see anything change now. Someone equated it to traffic laws. it will take a child getting seriously injured and the USASF being sued for them to even begin to address this. Hell they won't even put out a statement regarding the incident, they have their heads buried posting crap about "loyalty" on their Twitter.
I would encourage parents and coaches that were there to contact Disney with this video and the pictures of the gates being sealed with people inside. Most likely you will get some kind of compensation for the gates/unorganized lines. As for the mat, that's up to the gyms to decide how much longer they are going to bend over for USASF and Varsity.

It's egregious. Simply gross negligence and only by luck no one was catastrophically hurt.

 

[SL&AM]

Just to clarify, SE is not upset we lost, we are upset that at least three rules were broken and ignored! Yes, we could sit back and just take our lose "quietly" but then that leaves the door open for usasf to continue to do whatever they want at the expense of our kids. It's just time to do what is right. Congrats to F5 for pulling it together and hitting better than the rest under these conditions. Their win was earned and nobody is arguing that they should not have won. My daughter immediately upon setting wiped her shoes off because they were wet. Nothing prepared her for what to do next but to "go on with the show" but I can tell you it's all she thought about for the next 2 1/2 minutes as she was competing her last performance. She was terrified trying to tumble on that Mat. She immediately went to her coaches irate that the conditions were unacceptable. We are thankful CSP and the rest of the CEA coaches care so much about their athletes! Win or lose not following the rules is not ok.

This may not sit well with many, but can I take a second to applaud you and those like you who are trying to bring all of this to light with as much noise as possible. Regardless of who won or who lost, sitting back quietly and accepting the unacceptable conditions does nothing for the safety of this sport or for the children who are still up and coming in this sport. As a parent of a child who sat, jumped up and down, and screamed next to me all weekend long talking about and dreaming about the day she can one day do what your daughter, and the children of many FBers, did this weekend, I'm thankful that no one is willing to just sit back and let it be because of kids like her---kids who are still in this sport, who aren't near retirement, and who are dreaming of what it'll be like to hit at World's. She is why I worry about how USASF handles this incident and she is why I continue to stay on boards like this one for information/knowledge---because one day, it might be her, but if this is how World's is going to be continued to be handled and nothing changes after this year; then I have to sit down and seriously consider our options of whether or not AS cheer continues to remain in her future.

 

[getsum]

The geeky side of me found this very interesting, but I'm not sure I completely understand dew point versus humidity, so I tried to look it up. I still don't get it. According to Weatherunderground ( no idea, is this an accurate source?) Florida temps did not reach dew point that day. The humidity, on the other hand was high, and increasing during the time period from 7-11. Does this make a difference? I don't get it.

as long as there is humidity of some level there will be a dew point. at about 10PM, the temp was 75F and the humidity was about 75%. that made the dew point 67F which is on the rather very humid or uncomfortable, according to scales the i've looked at.

i used Yesterday's and last weeks' weather in Orlando, Florida, USA & Dew Point Calculator to acquire that data.

http://www.invertedm.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/dewpointScale.jpg


here's a vid that explains humidity and dew point very well:

 

[MomMomMamaMom]

as long as there is humidity of some level there will be a dew point. at about 10PM, the temp was 75F and the humidity was about 75%. that made the dew point 67F which is on the rather very humid or uncomfortable, according to scales the i've looked at.

i used Yesterday's and last weeks' weather in Orlando, Florida, USA & Dew Point Calculator to acquire that data.

http://www.invertedm.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/dewpointScale.jpg


here's a vid that explains humidity and dew point very well:

But what is the dew point? Isn't it the temperature at which condensation would occur? Or am I misunderstanding that? I guess I'm curious as to why the surfaces would be wet?

 

[getsum]

But what is the dew point? Isn't it the temperature at which condensation would occur? Or am I misunderstanding that? I guess I'm curious as to why the surfaces would be wet?

the temperature of the surface, in this case the mat, would need to be measured. dew would form on it if the surface of the mat was 67F or less.

 

[MomMomMamaMom]

the temperature of the surface, in this case the mat, would need to be measured. dew would form on it if the surface of the mat was 67F or less.

Ok, so my next question would be why the mat would be so much cooler than the air? Is that normal? Sorry to derail thread, genuinely curious. But also wondering if there was some way USASF should have reasonably predicted the circumstances.

 

[getsum]

Ok, so my next question would be why the mat would be so much cooler than the air? Is that normal? Sorry to derail thread, genuinely curious. But also wondering if there was some way USASF should have reasonably predicted the circumstances.

heat absorption ability of the material; that would depend on the type of material itself and it's color.

 

[CookieMomster]

Ok, so my next question would be why the mat would be so much cooler than the air? Is that normal? Sorry to derail thread, genuinely curious. But also wondering if there was some way USASF should have reasonably predicted the circumstances.

The ground will be cooler than the air because the suns radiant heat is no longer warming it, hence why dew occurs in the evening and usually after a specific amount of time after sunset. Dew is caused by atmospheric vapour condensation. The surface cools faster than the air and condenses faster than it can evaporate. A cool surface + warmer air = Dew

Once you factor in humidity levels (with humidity being measurement of the moisture level in the air) plus keeping in mind the higher the humidity level the less ability for the air to absorb the moisture given off by the cool surface, thus creating a wet surface which is dew. Dew is very common, and in the colder months a similar reaction occurs to create frost. A similar phenomenon occurs when the ground is warmer than the air...you then get fog.

Anytime the ground/surface is either cooler or warmer than the air, a reaction will occur.

 

[specialtpass]

My daughter was there the entire day on Sunday and attended the finals at the baseball field. I was getting updates and she said it was very bad. I have never been a fan of Worlds. The fact that the title World Champion is competed on the worst scoresheet of the season with poor inconsistent judging and ludicrous celebration penalties has boggled my mind. Worlds has become about any team can win and not the elite event it should be. The third year on a humid Florida baseball field has resulted in the same unsafe conditions. Why is anyone surprised? The only difference this year is that LAG parents are much more organized and vocal in their outrage and are screaming from the rooftops. I know this might not be a popular opinion but until the gym owners stop going back and refuse to participate they are just as complicit as the USASF in my opinion. The outrage displayed on the field was a day late and dollar short. Until gyms get honest about just how unprestigious the comp really is and turn their nose up to chasing paid bids they will have no influence or power. Return your focus to the NCA title as the Gold Standard it should be with your athletes and parents. If you continue to participate and return to the current offering nothing with the USASF and Worlds will ever change.

 

[MomMomMamaMom]

The ground will be cooler than the air because the suns radiant heat is no longer warming it, hence why dew occurs in the evening and usually after a specific amount of time after sunset. Dew is caused by atmospheric vapour condensation. The surface cools faster than the air and condenses faster than it can evaporate. A cool surface + warmer air = Dew

Once you factor in humidity levels (with humidity being measurement of the moisture level in the air) plus keeping in mind the higher the humidity level the less ability for the air to absorb the moisture given off by the cool surface, thus creating a wet surface which is dew. Dew is very common, and in the colder months a similar reaction occurs to create frost. A similar phenomenon occurs when the ground is warmer than the air...you then get fog.

Anytime the ground/surface is either cooler or warmer than the air, a reaction will occur.

So basically the fact that it was warm and humid and the sun wasn't out, made it slippery out there.. Which was foreseeable,and when I look at weather underground, it appears that the conditions were very close to the same last year, like really similar. So why didn't it happen last year? Or did it? Did the USASF do something different last year? Or was this part of the reason for the multiple injuries last year?

 

[CookieMomster]

I can't speak for last year and conditions, but science says dew will ALWAYS occur when those conditions are present. It also depends on the humidity levels. If last year had lower humidity levels, then the dew would have settled later in the evening as the air temps dropped, and if the dew occurred later in the evening then it wouldn't have affected the mat surfaces at the precise, same time as it did this year.

There are many factors that play into the amount of dew. If it's a hot, cloudless, sunny day there is a higher chance of increased dew levels (cloudless day creates more radiant heat on surfaces). If it's an overcast day, there is less radiant heat on surfaces and less dew on those evenings. So if last year was a partly cloudy day, or it was sunny in the morning but had some clouds in the afternoon the dew levels will be less.

 

[UCFKnights07]

Ill agree wth florida having bad humidity, im just getting out of work now at 1am and its humid as heck even this late at night.

 

[disneydance]

At the 2000 Olympics in Sydney the vault was set at the wrong height during part of the all around competition. After they realized the vault was at the incorrect height they gave the gymnast the option to recompete vault. The deal was the second vault would be their score if they chose to recompete. My question is why did this have to be a unanimous decision why couldn't they have done something similar. You break your own rule you allow a recompete if they choose with that score counting.

 

[AScheer]

Ill agree wth florida having bad humidity, im just getting out of work now at 1am and its humid as heck even this late at night.

Really I know there are so many other things that are bigger deals, but I feel like this is just another factor that USASF should have considered over the years. We know that F5, CEA and Rays (probably others) were all doing late night and outdoor practices. Teams are training to adapt to long waits and late nights (the fact that they even have to train for these things is ridiculous but not my current point.) What many teams have no possible way of training for is the humidity. If you aren't used to humidity it can knock the breath out of you and make you feel sticky and slippery just by walking much less competing a level 5 routine. If you don't live in an area that has high humidity, what are you supposed to do? Purchase massive industrial sized humidifiers and blast them in the gym so you can practice for finals? Even then it wouldn't be the same (if such things even exist.) Are we know wanting teams to come to Florida weeks early to train and adapt? In the Thailand documentary years ago they addressed the awful FL humidity. They flew in weeks early to adapt to the time change and the humidity, because their bodies don't function the same in it.

I've competed outside in the Florida sun before around this same time of year. It was awful and our gym never returned to that comp. Fortunately it wasn't a competition as big as worlds and it wasn't the end of our gyms business because we decided not to return.