High School Double Downs @ Hs Level

[Goosepatrick]

F. - Tosses
F.4.g -Multi-base Tosses to cradles are prohibited on surfaces other than a mat or grass (real or artificial). Basketball court is neither, so I would say prohibited. The toss in general, whether a skill was performed or not, that cradles is illegal on a basketball court. One slip of the catch and flyer hits ground. Not very safe.

 

[goBIGgreen21]

Look at the coaching in HS...Most of the time it's the art or history teacher looking to make a few extra bucks a semester and has NO CLUE on how to properly coach cheerleading. Sure, they get certified, but until you really put the time into learning how to really coach our sport they are burned out from HS Cheer.

I love working with new coaches on how proper technique should be used.

I have to disagree with this.. at least in the state of IL. I know SEVERAL who are full times coaches. They live it, breathe it, and spend almost all of their time focusing on their team. Then again this only applies to the higher skilled teams in our state.

 

[ONE44cheer]

I have to disagree with this.. at least in the state of IL. I know SEVERAL who are full times coaches. They live it, breathe it, and spend almost all of their time focusing on their team. Then again this only applies to the higher skilled teams in our state.

That's what I mean....you do have those coaches that live and breath cheer...but that's at established programs. But for most other schools...the turn around rate is lest than 4 semester for cheer coaches.

I live in Arizona and 4 semester is a long time for cheer coaches out here.

But Arizona is a crazy state in the cheer world. I have to fight the rule year after year of either the cheerleader picking HS or All Star...You cannot do both in our state. And I was very lucky to keep the talent on my Varsity team this year.

 

[ONE44cheer]

I have a Question for all reading this thread.....

For Junior High Teams....Would you count a helicopter toss as an illegal toss in JH. But following all rules. Top girl remaining face up and only tossing 180 degrees with 4 catchers.

Let me know what y'all think.

 

[mariahnicole1216]

I have to disagree with this.. at least in the state of IL. I know SEVERAL who are full times coaches. They live it, breathe it, and spend almost all of their time focusing on their team. Then again this only applies to the higher skilled teams in our state.

Agreed. Im from Illinois also and we have 3 main coaches and 2 are full time. Plus our tumbling coach is from an allstar background and cheer is literally all he does. People underestimate HS cheer.

 

[goBIGgreen21]

That's what I mean....you do have those coaches that live and breath cheer...but that's at established programs. But for most other schools...the turn around rate is lest than 4 semester for cheer coaches.

I live in Arizona and 4 semester is a long time for cheer coaches out here.

But Arizona is a crazy state in the cheer world. I have to fight the rule year after year of either the cheerleader picking HS or All Star...You cannot do both in our state. And I was very lucky to keep the talent on my Varsity team this year.

Same in Illinois. It's a choice between allstar and high school.

 

[ttumble0819]

I like this, except I don't think nationals should be limited. I doubt nationals will be limited to only advance, heck they have an intermediate division at NCA College Nationals. And that would be lost revenue. It is a business after all.

I don't know about validating level at camp my team is totally at a different level from camp to say October. We are a small program - we get a
Bunch of new team
Members each season since we do not start practice until
August looking at the team after 6 practices is not
Going to be a fair look of the skill level for the year. Maybe coaches should be certified in levels like all stars so they can appropriately place their team and teach the appropriate skills safely. I think the majority of classes that high school coaches have to take to maintain their coaching
Certification in Ct are silly and have nothing to do with being a better 'cheer' coach

 

[ttumble0819]

All of the levels and certification sound good....but in a realistic view - if a school/state is mandating the cheerleading coaches be certified at any level (AACA or NFHS) then they must pay for that certification. It can become a political nightmare as far as public schools paying private/for-profit entities for certification to compete in school sanctioned events.

At that point - who's budget would it come from? Athletics or Student Activities? Then we're getting into the age old debate...

In most states there is already coaching certification that is taught by the state. It totally supersedes AACA or NFHS because it includes safety plus more. Having (AACA/NFHS) certification is great, and means a coach is willing to go the extra mile for education, but its not required or even necessary these days. Safety is in the hands of the coach - ultimately the athletic director - and administration (for hiring a proficient coach).

My opinion - LOVE DOUBLES!! Great technique means everything.

In Connecticut we must hold a coaching certification from the state it's about $500 the first year and then you keep up your ceu's by taking classes which is less but still
An expense. In our school the coach MUST pay for this 100% out of
Pocket

 

[gofriars610]

In Maine there are not enough teams to have different levels. We are already divided up by school size.
There is a very very harsh penalty for a flyer landing on her stomach after a twist. This effectively makes it so that teams that cannot safely perform double downs 100% of the time do not attempt them in competition. I've seen a state championship lost over a double down gone wrong. It's not worth the risk. I think this is a good system to have.

 

[MissBee]

I don't know about validating level at camp my team is totally at a different level from camp to say October. We are a small program - we get a
Bunch of new team
Members each season since we do not start practice until
August looking at the team after 6 practices is not
Going to be a fair look of the skill level for the year. Maybe coaches should be certified in levels like all stars so they can appropriately place their team and teach the appropriate skills safely.

I don't like the idea of coaches validating their own team, or even validating other teams....it allows for favoritism and/or sabotage (ie: I choreographed your routine, so I'm going to validate you at a lower level so you'll do better in comps at that level OR I coach another team in the area, so I'm going to validate you at a higher level so you flop at comps). I think that those validating teams for levels would have to be completely unaffiliated. They can judge and validate, but not coach or choreograph.
As far as teams improving over the year, of course they will. There needs to be a cut off for validation, say October 31st. That level is the level you are for the year. This prevents teams from moving on in progression too soon. So many times I see a team that does OK at their level in a Dec comp, but sees other teams at that comp doing more difficult skills. The team decides to add those skills to their routine (but because they hadn't mastered the lower level skills they do these new, harder skills poorly). I see them at a comp in January and they look terrible....had they spent the month perfecting the easier skills, they would have placed higher-instead they're a hot mess on the floor.
I'd like to see the teams validated at say a "novice" level have to compete novice level skills, but could practice on the next level up skills (or whatever the levels are named).

Something needs to be put in place to force teams into sticking to skill progression. The levels system and athlete credentialing in All Star is not perfect, but it's something....and this needs to happen in High School as well. I don't know of any research, but I bet if you factor in hours and number of participants-HS probably has more/worse injuries than AS (just my speculation, no data, no proof).