All-Star Universal Score Sheet Pros/cons

[simplymom]

We were discussing this a little in another thread. I was hoping that some of my new wise Fierce Board friends could help me understand.

I can see the pros of a universal score sheet. I see teams that change their routine to maximize the upcoming eps score sheet. I think that practice time could be better utilized in making fun and innovative changes to improve their routine over all. Or spending more practice time learning new stunts etc.

As far as Worlds' bids go...I think the universal score sheet with a base line score to achieve a bid would be a good solution to complaints of "everyone that tries, gets a bid." As I said in another thread...I can understand the frustrations of some, that towards the end of the season, a 7th,8th,9th place team can earn a handed-down, at large bid.

What are the cons of a universal score sheet?
My impression is that a universal score sheet will never happen. Why is that? Is it USASF or eps?

 

[INeverStopCheering]

I think it's EPs. Coaches are pushing for it too much for USASF to not eventually cave. EPs will resist because it eliminates competition between companies. While gyms now have to choose the scoresheets they like best, if all scoresheets are the same, there's no competition. It essentially creates a cheeropoly. Coaches will start looking at other things, like prizes, venues, and vacation location. This means to stay competitive, EPs will have to put out more money in venues and prizes to attract potential competitors, while still offering competitive entrance fees. Don't get me wrong, I am absolutely in favor of unified scoresheets, but this is a problem that needs to be addressed

 

[King]

I am ALL for a universal scoresheet. I do find it funny that we spend the whole season building and making routines one way (as well judges spend all that time thinking of cheerleading one way) and then two weeks before Worlds they learn how to judge a completely different and new way. It is like football teams playing with touch downs worth 6 points all year, but then they make touch downs worth three and field goals worth 6 JUST for the super bowl. It is still played like football, but changes your strategy for just one big event.

I will saw for the performances given in general the placements were correct. But I do think not having to adjust and change all year we would have seen more hitting at Worlds. And shouldn't worlds be the best hitting event of the season?

 

[Jennaw]

I am ALL for a universal scoresheet. I do find it funny that we spend the whole season building and making routines one way (as well judges spend all that time thinking of cheerleading one way) and then two weeks before Worlds they learn how to judge a completely different and new way. It is like football teams playing with touch downs worth 6 points all year, but then they make touch downs worth three and field goals worth 6 JUST for the super bowl. It is still played like football, but changes your strategy for just one big event.

I will saw for the performances given in general the placements were correct. But I do think not having to adjust and change all year we would have seen more hitting at Worlds. And shouldn't worlds be the best hitting event of the season?

Agree. From a judges standpoint, I think that we work all year on a single scoresheet and become used to the scoring system for which we judge for. To have the variety of judges that score all on different types of sheets throughout the year, come together and score a new sheet for the first time at a worlds event.... its a little iffy....

I favor the Varsity score system (computerized)

 

[simplymom]

I am ALL for a universal scoresheet. I do find it funny that we spend the whole season building and making routines one way (as well judges spend all that time thinking of cheerleading one way) and then two weeks before Worlds they learn how to judge a completely different and new way. It is like football teams playing with touch downs worth 6 points all year, but then they make touch downs worth three and field goals worth 6 JUST for the super bowl. It is still played like football, but changes your strategy for just one big event.

I will saw for the performances given in general the placements were correct. But I do think not having to adjust and change all year we would have seen more hitting at Worlds. And shouldn't worlds be the best hitting event of the season?

Absolutely!

Don't most eps use different scoring systems? For example, this year my cps team competed at 2 different events. At both events the team nailed their routine. They were competing against many of the same teams at both events. 1 event they were second to last out of 7-8 teams. (I can't remember exactly anymore.) The next event (fairly big comp.) they won Grand Champs with the exact same routine. The main difference between the two was that our coach maxed the score sheet at the second. I just think it's unfair to ask gyms to rework their routine for every different competition. It just really frustrates me! IMO the best over-all team should win. Not necessarily the team that "works the score sheet."

 

[fullpass]

Reviving this old thread to say that I was at a comp last weekend where I saw a really good team get beaten (badly too!) by a really mediocre team because of judging differences and not tweaking the routine to the scoresheet. I am now 100% fully on board because what I witnessed was a travesty!

 

[nvecchioni89]

I do like how varsity is computerized, not sure if they are all that way, we only attended one event by them this year and let me just say it was GREAT not having to sit there for 10 minutes trying to figure out what in the world the comments say. The only thing I would like to see if there is a universal score sheet, is a breakdown on how to max. I may have missed where varsity had a full breakdown, the one I saw was really vague so I was unsure as to how they would score. Some companies do a great job with this already, just hope to see that trend continue. I really dont see why we couldnt have a universal one, I dont see it being a difficult process. EP's are represented on the Board, if they have time to sit down and make up silly rules, they have time to sit down and come up with a scoresheet that everyone can agree on.

 

[Nothanks]

i want to say someone made a thread about this before, but i have no idea what it was or what was in it to search it...but can we post the pros and cons/breakdowns of the different brands of score sheets? ( like which one typically looks for what )

 

[VTX]

I know the only local comp we lost at this year (to a team we beat by a big margin at another comp) we asked why their score sheet was so different and they said it was so they could give a option other than varsity's.

 

[yojaehs]

I am 100% for a Universal Score Sheet. We competed at Indy, NCA, Cheersport and UCA and let me say it was dang near impossible to give the kids a chance to relax because we were constantly adding a flip here, taking a flip out there, adding a jump for this one, taking away a jump and adding a clap. It's just annoying. And we went to em all and would continue if we didn't have to constantly change. I see us removing one of the big comps bc we have to change too much.

I had this thought as well, not so much on score sheet, but we discussed the fact that there are too many comps and warm ups are still not up to par so let me throw this out there and here your thoughts.

Ok, we all agree that there are too many comps, WHAT IF ALL comps were required to have the same warm ups as Worlds? I say this bc events often times short change the warm up area to save money. My theory is, if ALL events were required to do this then there would be less events but HIGHER quality events. Yeah I know EP's won't be in favor and this would be darn near impossible to pass but to me it just makes sense. This past weekend we went to a Varsity event, then tumbling strip was too short (end of strip was flat against the wall) and had to continually be put back together. Yes, this means less comps, but EP's wouldn't host events unless they had a certain number of teams (increasing competition). Just an idea, ready to hear your thoughts!

 

[5-6-7-8]

Yes, I am in favor of a universal scoresheet, and I'll raise you uniformly trained judges so those scoresheets are utilized roughly the sameness way. Universal scoresheets themselves won't help if the judges are still valuing difficulty and execution differently.

 

[flcheermom]

I am 100% for a Universal Score Sheet. We competed at Indy, NCA, Cheersport and UCA and let me say it was dang near impossible to give the kids a chance to relax because we were constantly adding a flip here, taking a flip out there, adding a jump for this one, taking away a jump and adding a clap. It's just annoying. And we went to em all and would continue if we didn't have to constantly change. I see us removing one of the big comps bc we have to change too much.

I had this thought as well, not so much on score sheet, but we discussed the fact that there are too many comps and warm ups are still not up to par so let me throw this out there and here your thoughts.

Ok, we all agree that there are too many comps, WHAT IF ALL comps were required to have the same warm ups as Worlds? I say this bc events often times short change the warm up area to save money. My theory is, if ALL events were required to do this then there would be less events but HIGHER quality events. Yeah I know EP's won't be in favor and this would be darn near impossible to pass but to me it just makes sense. This past weekend we went to a Varsity event, then tumbling strip was too short (end of strip was flat against the wall) and had to continually be put back together. Yes, this means less comps, but EP's wouldn't host events unless they had a certain number of teams (increasing competition). Just an idea, ready to hear your thoughts!

I would LOVE to have less comps but higher quality ones that have actual competition within a reasonable driving distance even...consolidate some of these small cheesy ones that are held in crappy venues with crappy warm ups and crappy seating that we compete against no one - in our area of central florida with tampa/orlando/jacksonville etc -there are too many small comps that we have no competition at.. I know other gyms have to have teams in the same division as you to compete against - but if there were less comps, but bigger nicer ones to choose from - even a couple of hours away - maybe more teams from further away would come - and we would also drive for a quality event - IF that was all there was to choose from..

 

[Morgankay88]

Yes, I am in favor of a universal scoresheet, and I'll raise you uniformly trained judges so those scoresheets are utilized roughly the sameness way. Universal scoresheets themselves won't help if the judges are still valuing difficulty and execution differently.

I think I love you! This has been my complaint since I entered the cheer world. Can we get some consistent judging... and make sure all judges are trained adequately and know what they are talking about!

Last year our level 2 team got a safety deduction for doing a plain, good old barrel roll. This year we had the judges tell us that if a team has one layout that is worth the same as my team having 10/15 people having layouts. Everyone is afraid to put in anything innovative in their routines locally because the judges here give you deductions for it because they don't understand the rules.

 

[CGAcheer]

I am 100% for a Universal Score Sheet. We competed at Indy, NCA, Cheersport and UCA and let me say it was dang near impossible to give the kids a chance to relax because we were constantly adding a flip here, taking a flip out there, adding a jump for this one, taking away a jump and adding a clap. It's just annoying. And we went to em all and would continue if we didn't have to constantly change. I see us removing one of the big comps bc we have to change too much.

I had this thought as well, not so much on score sheet, but we discussed the fact that there are too many comps and warm ups are still not up to par so let me throw this out there and here your thoughts.

Ok, we all agree that there are too many comps, WHAT IF ALL comps were required to have the same warm ups as Worlds? I say this bc events often times short change the warm up area to save money. My theory is, if ALL events were required to do this then there would be less events but HIGHER quality events. Yeah I know EP's won't be in favor and this would be darn near impossible to pass but to me it just makes sense. This past weekend we went to a Varsity event, then tumbling strip was too short (end of strip was flat against the wall) and had to continually be put back together. Yes, this means less comps, but EP's wouldn't host events unless they had a certain number of teams (increasing competition). Just an idea, ready to hear your thoughts!

4 mins on each floor was too quick too

 

[yojaehs]

I feel like judges would be better if they only had to learn one score sheet. Teams and judges would be better.