All-Star Discussing The Value Of Tumbling In Io(c) 5/6

[hiyoe6]

In my opinion... Open level 5 teams should be much more equal stunting vs tumbling. Open level 6 teams should have stunting much more highly weighed.

 

[wcsstilldeath]

Why not Just a WIKI entry?

well that would make alot more sense, i didnt think of that haha

 

[King]

http://fierceboard.com/forum/wiki/cheer-how-to/

go nuts

back to our thread. tumbling aint worth jack. discuss

 

[King]

no offense to jack

 

[NowImFamous]

king after reading all your posts, i do say you have such good points! from the beg. i was telling all my friends that i thought fire would do so well because of the un-assisted stunts, granted i've heard so many different opinions about top 3 international coed at worlds but after reading the score sheets OVER AND OVER again, the stunts fire is doing will hit the score sheets so well. granted i do love watching teams like steel and wildcats.

 

[Drkilluzionz]

Worlds International scoresheets just don't make sense as is. The majority of American all star score sheets appropriate equal amounts of points to both tumbling (running and standing) and building skills (stunts and pyramids) which is what the athletes are trained for. Once graduated the athletes now go to international teams b/c the industry has pretty much done away with regular open teams...a few still exist but everyone wants to be at Worlds so 99.9% just enter international. Unless some unethical rumors I hear about them prove to be true, the people sitting behind desks who have control over these score sheets definitely had other options to choose from to continue making more and more money off of Worlds:

Let i5 reflect the balance that is tumbling and building skills and let i6 have a stunting emphasis (makes sense...those with the complete package have a division and those who feel "disadvantaged" due to tumbling and choreography but find the time to excel at stunting also have a division and teams from the US and other countries can enter either)

Introduce the "Open" division to Worlds and leave International for teams outside the U.S. (it's done in every other division at Worlds anyway and this would certainly entice more US teams into the event with there not being a US preliminary comp)

I personally don't like what they reflect at all...and I encourage all the gym owners and coaches around the country to think about the graduating level 5 kids they have in their program (boys especially) see the current industry trends and instead of quietly sitting back and pondering why things the way they are...speak up and get answers...

 

[King]

Worlds International scoresheets just don't make sense as is. The majority of American all star score sheets appropriate equal amounts of points to both tumbling (running and standing) and building skills (stunts and pyramids) which is what the athletes are trained for. Once graduated the athletes now go to international teams b/c the industry has pretty much done away with regular open teams...a few still exist but everyone wants to be at Worlds so 99.9% just enter international. Unless some unethical rumors I hear about them prove to be true, the people sitting behind desks who have control over these score sheets definitely had other options to choose from to continue making more and more money off of Worlds:

Let i5 reflect the balance that is tumbling and building skills and let i6 have a stunting emphasis (makes sense...those with the complete package have a division and those who feel "disadvantaged" due to tumbling and choreography but find the time to excel at stunting also have a division and teams from the US and other countries can enter either)

Introduce the "Open" division to Worlds and leave International for teams outside the U.S. (it's done in every other division at Worlds anyway and this would certainly entice more US teams into the event with there not being a US preliminary comp)

I personally don't like what they reflect at all...and I encourage all the gym owners and coaches around the country to think about the graduating level 5 kids they have in their program (boys especially) see the current industry trends and instead of quietly sitting back and pondering why things the way they are...speak up and get answers...

I feel like you just had your a-ha moment.

 

[torsten]

I think the "international" part is what causes the disbalance between tumbling and stunting in the scoresheet. As a German I have to say this is a good thing, because most of the teams here in Germany only have hard floors to practice on. Therefor our tumbling usually isn't as advanced as the tumbling of the U.S. teams. Scoring the tumbling less is leveling the playfield for everyone.

 

[King]

Hence why open teams should be seperate from international divisions and US shouldn't be allowed in international.

 

[torsten]

I think U.S. teams should be allowed in the international division, because one of the most interesting things for international teams in my opinion is to compete against U.S. teams. Without U.S. teams I feel it would be like in the times when the U.S. basketball team didn't compete in the Olympics basketball tournament.

But I agree that there should still be an open division with a more balanced score sheet.

 

[King]

Good. Because wanting to compete with US teams but not allowing them to use what they spend a lot of the time practicing isn't really competing against them.

 

[Drkilluzionz]

I feel like you just had your a-ha moment.

LOL, Similar too

 

[King]

LOL, Similar too

Not sure what the similar too means, but I would much prefer balance in open 5. I dont think double fulls should be worth more than squad full tick tocks or be worth more than perfectly executed triple toe backs. To max out in a category should be HARD. So hard that most of todays teams should not be able to do it. It would create balance. It would create strategies. It would allow that awesome stunting team to have a shot against that awesome tumbling team.

But ehh... what do i know

 

[Mrs.CheerExtreme]

Good. Because wanting to compete with US teams but not allowing them to use what they spend a lot of the time practicing isn't really competing against them.

If international teams didn't spend as much time tumbling then they can use that time to practice their stunts. If most of the I5 athletes are former L5 athletes then they've probably competed their full or double at Worlds at some point...they've had the tumbling glory so now they can use their extra time to become really good at something else too (not that they weren't good before).
You just can't leave the U.S. teams out of the international division. Thats like telling the host country for the Olympics that they can't participate in the Olympics.
Back to the original topic...that is COMPLETELY ridiculous. If L6 had the stunting emphasis then people would actually understand the difference between L5 and L6 (I still don't really understand the difference between the 2). Tumbling is a big part of cheerleading, you can't just say that it is only worth .6% of the total score when it should all almost be equal. I don't feel that the fact that international teams usually practice on hard floors should make a difference. What do schools compete, practice and cheer on??? If anything I think it would be to their advantage to tumble on those hard floors and then when they go to Worlds with that spring floor they have an advantage because tumbling on that spring floor will be easier than what they are use to.
I've never been on a L5 team, but if I was ever on one I would want all of that time, effort, money and sweat I put into it to be acknowledged and reflected on the score sheet. If my full that I worked so hard to get doesn't really make that big of a difference on the score sheet then why would I want to get one in the first place if I can stick with tucks or layouts and be perfectly fine.

 

[rvnblue]

Kingston, you did what most persuasive speakers do, however. You skewed the numbers a little. (Slight difference but large in the long run). You showed how there is only 1 point "up for grabs" in the top tier of the tumbling sections so, if you add up the top tiers of each section, which I'm sure you are well aware allows for the total possible points the top contenders in each division should be getting, the total is 78 if my math suffices.

2/78 = 2.5% which is much greater than .6%