All-Star Cali Aces Jamz Incident

[5-6-7-8]

Point flyer (one of the ones with the gash in her head, I believe) went on. She was involved in the crash. I'm not sure if the girl with the torn ACL went on or not. (people already said this before I hit post, it was an easy mistake to make though with everyone running around the mat, no worries!) But I agree NEliteSteven , if the athlete feels well enough to go on, they will go on. If they don't, they will stop. If the athlete is on the ground and cannot get up, the EP will stop the music. If the athlete gets up to continue, they will let it go on. They had no idea how bad the incident was until the team got off the floor. They probably assumed the athlete was fine since she flew point and did all of her tumbling passes. If you saw someone get up from a collision and do all that, I doubt anyone would stop the music. You'd stop it until you saw blood, right? Until you saw how bad that injury actually is. Which is exactly what they did.

I think everyone is making a huge deal about this. People got hurt, they got the medical attention they required and they are/will be OK. The ones who couldn't go on removed themselves from the floor and the ones who thought they could go on, did. Does USASF need to re-evalute safety protocols? Probably. But this specific situation has been blown out of proportions. :chillpill:

If it is any other injury, I agree. However, when it comes to a possible head injury, I think that's where we can get in trouble. I wouldn't necessarily trust someone with a possible head injury to decide if she/he is able to continue performing.

 

[Mclovin]

This is the only part of this incident that I'm concerned/confused about...we all know cheerleading is 100% team oriented. If a SINGLE member of our team is injured in any way and leaves the floor, some portion of our routine will not be able to hit properly and safely. Bottom line -- music needs to be stopped the moment ANYONE leaves the floor or is unable to continue the routine for any reason. Heck, competitions run behind for SO many ridiculous reasons...an injury is for sure one I wouldn't be complaining about.

This isn't an issue that a coach or EP should have to "decide" on. It should be mandated in our rules that if any athlete on the performance surface is unable to continue the routine, the music is immediately stopped. PERIOD.

 

[cheersafety]

This is the only part of this incident that I'm concerned/confused about...we all know cheerleading is 100% team oriented. If a SINGLE member of our team is injured in any way and leaves the floor, some portion of our routine will not be able to hit properly and safely. Bottom line -- music needs to be stopped the moment ANYONE leaves the floor or is unable to continue the routine for any reason. Heck, competitions run behind for SO many ridiculous reasons...an injury is for sure one I wouldn't be complaining about.

This isn't an issue that a coach or EP should have to "decide" on. It should be mandated in our rules that if any athlete on the performance surface is unable to continue the routine, the music is immediately stopped. PERIOD.

McLovin I have often liked your posts but you are dead on today!

 

[DropAndRun]

Good Lord.. I didn't realize until just now how much the one girl from the collision did afterward until now when someone mentioned shed completed all of her passes and I went back and watched just her the whole routine. That's really unbelieveable! It looked like when she stood still that she was kind of disoriented.. When she stands in the back left corner before that one pass she takes a wobbly step sideways before she goes. I'm also I amazed at the type of flying she was doing having them flip her around upside down and sideways before she went up. I can't imagine what that must have felt like. I don't know whether I should be amazed or devastated. Maybe I'm both.

 

[CheerMomNTx]

I can't even imagine!! Head injuries are a serious, serious thing! You can recover from an ankle/knee injury but brain injuries are more serious and you might not make a full recovery. Is our industry teaching these kids to just push through no matter what?

 

[Mclovin]

I can't even imagine!! Head injuries are a serious, serious thing! You can recover from an ankle/knee injury but brain injuries are more serious and you might not make a full recovery. Is our industry teaching these kids to just push through no matter what?

I almost posted a comment relating to just that and then deleted it because I got too wordy, lol. But yes, I think we do teach our kids to push through. I know I teach my kids to be tough and to keep going if at all possible. Which I think is very important to teach in life in general. Which is why I think there should be rules in place by the USASF to stop the routine no matter what if someone is unable to finish the routine. Kids do not want to let their teammates down, their coaches down, their parents down...they will continue if they are able. I bet that girl didn't even realize how badly she was really injured til she left the floor. When your adrenaline is pumping your body can ignore very important signs that it's hurting. Kids shouldn't have to be the ones making that call...

 

[creator13]

We had an ACL tear over the weekend too and you can see me turn around and wave at judges to stop, and I was waving and yelling stop to the kids on the floor.....and after the music never stopped I didn't know what to do other than encourage them to continue....

 

[CheerMomNTx]

I almost posted a comment relating to just that and then deleted it because I got too wordy, lol. But yes, I think we do teach our kids to push through. I know I teach my kids to be tough and to keep going if at all possible. Which I think is very important to teach in life in general. Which is why I think there should be rules in place by the USASF to stop the routine no matter what if someone is unable to finish the routine. Kids do not want to let their teammates down, their coaches down, their parents down...they will continue if they are able. I bet that girl didn't even realize how badly she was really injured til she left the floor. When your adrenaline is pumping your body can ignore very important signs that it's hurting. Kids shouldn't have to be the ones making that call...

Off subject a bit, but I have read articles of ppl being in car accidents with limbs missing and not realizing it because of the shock, etc. So yes that is a big possibility.

 

[luxerae]

I don't think this has been blown out of proportion at all. If anything, it's made us more aware of the safety protocols that we do not have and that we need to put in place. In my opinion, it's better to be safe than sorry. When any type of collision or visible accident like that occurs, the music should be cut short. End of story. I am not placing blame on coaches, EPs, or the team itself as I was not there and I don't know exactly how the situation played out. I know that it appeared as though they were fine as they continued on, but regardless, that was a possible head injury. I think somebody earlier had posted that someone had gotten a head injury was advised to go to the hospital, but claimed they were fine, then they started to feel the concussion, but it was too late. That very well could have happened to one of these girls or any other cheerleader involved in a collision in the future.

 

[Mclovin]

Off subject a bit, but I have read articles of ppl being in car accidents with limbs missing and not realizing it because of the shock, etc. So yes that is a big possibility.

Exactly. However, I also want to preface my comments by saying that sometimes it takes accidents like this to happen for the powers that be to realize that a rule needs to be in place. I have gotten on here and ranted and raved about rules the USASF needs to be implementing on safety, crossovers, illegal athletes, etc., but never once did I even think to suggest they needed a rule in place on when to stop a routine. So while I hate that this happened, at this point I hope the USASF can use this as an opportunity to review their safety standards and make changes where necessary.

 

[chyeeaaa69]

We had an ACL tear over the weekend too and you can see me turn around and wave at judges to stop, and I was waving and yelling stop to the kids on the floor.....and after the music never stopped I didn't know what to do other than encourage them to continue....

Call me crazy, if I was a coach in that instance, whether I'd face a penalty or not, I'd hop on that floor and stop the routine myself.

 

[crazyredhead]

We had an ACL tear over the weekend too and you can see me turn around and wave at judges to stop, and I was waving and yelling stop to the kids on the floor.....and after the music never stopped I didn't know what to do other than encourage them to continue....

On a side note the uni's are really cute and not to mention the one man..

 

[chyeeaaa69]

Okay this raises my next question...
An athlete's injured, routine continues, half of the pyramid doesn't go. Do the judges score as if that side of the pyramid hit perfectly or...? I know when an injury happens usually teams are scored in a 2nd run from where the injury occured, but if the routine isn't stopped and you aren't given a 2nd run, how do judges score something that doesn't go?

 

[King]

I am highly encouraged by the focus this event has brought upon our sport. I think if someone was to watch the video from Jamz it would not go over well with the general public (let alone us). So moving forward the things I would like as a coach:

What are the protocols for stopping a routine and how should it be done? Again I understand not hitting the off button on the music the second an injury is noted because of possible implications (music cutting off at certain points could have ripple affects leading to more injuries) but not letting it continue for minutes, especially when people have left the floor. I saw a team at UCA (I believe it was IOC5 and an international team) this past year where someone was injured during the performance. She crawled off the side, the trainers came and got her and carried her backstage. IDK what she had happen, but my guess is an ACL by what she grabbed and how she acted. She was injured in the first minute I believe. They finished the entire routine. That did bother me.

Are these protocols something I can apply to practice? If not, what should I do at practice? I have some practical applications in which I use for myself, but in what ways do I know that those are the most appropriate? I highly believe no one intentionally wants to do something that will hurt others, so without proper training how does a coach know when to make that call for an injury? Experience? Doesn't experience with how to handle an injury just mean you have seen these injuries before and probably made the wrong decision a few times before you made the right one?

 

[kristenthegreat]

I am highly encouraged by the focus this event has brought upon our sport. I think if someone was to watch the video from Jamz it would not go over well with the general public (let alone us). So moving forward the things I would like as a coach:

What are the protocols for stopping a routine and how should it be done? Again I understand not hitting the off button on the music the second an injury is noted because of possible implications (music cutting off at certain points could have ripple affects leading to more injuries) but not letting it continue for minutes, especially when people have left the floor. I saw a team at UCA (I believe it was IOC5 and an international team) this past year where someone was injured during the performance. She crawled off the side, the trainers came and got her and carried her backstage. IDK what she had happen, but my guess is an ACL by what she grabbed and how she acted. She was injured in the first minute I believe. They finished the entire routine. That did bother me.

Are these protocols something I can apply to practice? If not, what should I do at practice? I have some practical applications in which I use for myself, but in what ways do I know that those are the most appropriate? I highly believe no one intentionally wants to do something that will hurt others, so without proper training how does a coach know when to make that call for an injury? Experience? Doesn't experience with how to handle an injury just mean you have seen these injuries before and probably made the wrong decision a few times before you made the right one?

I can only answer the first one- perhaps slowly lower the music? That way it's not sudden and you don't get people thinking they should continue due to music malfunction? Although with that, I can only imagine the horror you'd feel as a team when that music starts going down..