All-Star Half + 1 To Max....

[drewpate]

I kinda want to take level 5 out of this conversation, because while I am passionate about it and it encompasses a lot of my job I have a couple of questions that relate to all levels.

1. If the event producers really are agreeing to half plus one maxing out your tumbling, can you please put it in writing and guarantee it now, because tryouts start in less than two weeks for me.

2. Should half + 1 be = to squad tumbling.

I was blessed to work with a team this year that I believe might put out the best level 2 tumbling numbers out there. (I'm not saying they had the prettiest or best timing). With above average technique my small mini 2 threw 88 standing bhs (except for One who occasionally was mental so it became 84 for some competitions.) this weekend that number will be 108. They have great variety, and yet have failed to max out a standing tumbling scoresheet this year (another issue lol)

Should a team that puts up 11 bwo bhs out of twenty equal their score? What if I put twenty on the floor and one kids feet slip on the Velcro causing her to fall to her butt after the pass, is that team of 11 skills better than mine now?

3. Is half plus one good for our sport

Honestly, I could make a lot of parents happy by only putting 11 tucks on a level 3 team and then putting 9 other kids who are in no way ready for level 3. Parents already think the level they are on means more than actual skill anyway.

4. Will half plus one increase injuries?

Say I start building teams without squad skills, when I need a particular person that doesn't have a skill to do one purely for choreography purposes do I ditch the idea or do I push a kid that's not ready.
Does that kid without a tuck think they are letting the team down and all of a sudden try something they aren't ready for?
For that matter will the 11 I put on to create a majority think they can get lazy and not do skills now because 9 others on the team don't have to do them?

5. What the heck is this teaching our kids?

Success in the real world takes either luck or a lot of hard work, sweat and tears. Half plus one can create a situation where a kid who is extremely out of shape, a lil bit lazy, and who doesn't care about being well rounded but is strong enough to stunt decently well a free ride to level 5.

I'm sorry honey, but you have to work to be at the top. I don't work 60+ hours a week because I enjoy it, I work that much because I strive to be successful at both my jobs. You should t get to be level 5 by only coming to practices when half plus one of your team has to come into the gym and work theirselves to death to make sure that they can carry half the scoresheet themselves.



This part of the ordeal has pissed me off more than anything else besides the shadyness of it all. And standing fulls, because that's the only decent level 5 skill I have lol.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

I think
Half + 1 gets you into max range. Max range doesn't mean you are maxing out. I don't think many teams are really maxing out in anything.

We don't have a scoresheet that allows you to "max out"

 

[viralscorp]

Does someone mind showing me where this "50% + 1" is coming from?

 

[katstat1]

It is coming from the memo that the usasf sent out.

One of the primary concerns related to the negative impact of the increased focus on elite tumbling skills. Most programs report an increase in the number and severity of injuries as the tumbling skills become more difficult. The focus on elite tumbling also restricts the growth of the sport because it limits the type of athletes who can compete. It was agreed among these event producers to use score sheets that maximize tumbling scores at "half plus one" to create a majority. This will allow for more diversity of athletes among all teams

 

[katstat1]

I think
Half + 1 gets you into max range. Max range doesn't mean you are maxing out. I don't think many teams are really maxing out in anything.

We don't have a scoresheet that allows you to "max out"

It does say "maximize tumbling score at half plus one" so doesn't that mean maxing out? I don't agree with that at all.

In our gym they always say what tumbling is needed to be on a certain level team. There are always exceptions I get that, but for the most part you have to be able to do those skills. It will be interesting to see if that changes much. I guess I just want kids to keep working on that skill knowing that is what they need to be on a team. If they get on a team and they don't have that tuck, layout, full, whatever, I don't want them thinking they can just not worry about it because their team already has majority plus 1. In some ways this could definitely help our smaller gym because we make up a team with 9 kids that might be close to a skill but not quite there yet, but I am still for getting a higher score the more you have doing the skill.

 

[viralscorp]

Thanks, I missed that the first time I read the memo.

 

[JulieP]

I think
Half + 1 gets you into max range. Max range doesn't mean you are maxing out. I don't think many teams are really maxing out in anything.

We don't have a scoresheet that allows you to "max out"

You can actually "max out" on the jam brands scoresheet for difficulty and quantities. It's the only score sheet where I've had that experience. At other competitions, I have seen my team with full team tumbling get beaten in these categories by bigger teams with a much smaller percentage of tumbling. Not sure what the right answer is, but it just doesn't feel right to have full team skills and not get rewarded for it accordingly.

 

[Cheerfan1234]

You can actually "max out" on the jam brands scoresheet for difficulty and quantities. It's the only score sheet where I've had that experience. At other competitions, I have seen my team with full team tumbling get beaten in these categories by bigger teams with a much smaller percentage of tumbling. Not sure what the right answer is, but it just doesn't feel right to have full team skills and not get rewarded for it accordingly.

I don't know where you're from, but my only thought is that maybe your team was outscored because the team with only half+1 had better overall technique than your full squad tumbling?

I was always under the impression that half +1 getting you into the max range was the standard rule of thumb for a few years now, so I'm confused as to why the USASF just released this as something new for 2012-2013. Can someone explain/clarify?

If this is now going to be truly enforced, I'm sure their reasoning is to level the playing field (especially because of the dying Senior Large Level 5 division) but also to encourage teams to focus more on technique over quantity, which I think is a good thing ONLY if the teams with better technique are rewarded accordingly even if they have less tumbling than their competition.

 

[viralscorp]

I was always under the impression that half +1 getting you into the max range was the standard rule of thumb for a few years now, so I'm confused as to why the USASF just released this as something new for 2012-2013. Can someone explain/clarify?

I think (and I can't confirm, because now even the text of the announcement has been removed from the USASF website) that the announcement implied that you could get the same tumbling difficulty score with 50% +1 as with 100%.

This is different from this season because while 50% +1 gets you into the top range, you should score higher with the more athletes performing the skill.

 

[CoachTamara]

I don't know where you're from, but my only thought is that maybe your team was outscored because the team with only half+1 had better overall technique than your full squad tumbling?

I was always under the impression that half +1 getting you into the max range was the standard rule of thumb for a few years now, so I'm confused as to why the USASF just released this as something new for 2012-2013. Can someone explain/clarify?

If this is now going to be truly enforced, I'm sure their reasoning is to level the playing field (especially because of the dying Senior Large Level 5 division) but also to encourage teams to focus more on technique over quantity, which I think is a good thing ONLY if the teams with better technique are rewarded accordingly even if they have less tumbling than their competition.

I think it's pretty common on the varsity scoresheet to really hurt you if you have a small team... They don't seem to take size into consideration the way Jamfest does. Last year we had a team of 15 and saw the differences in scoresheets. We had a very solid team and got nailed in a few places where we had to go against large teams that dropped and had tumbling busts when we hit.

I've always understood you need half + 1 to get into max range, but I don't think that will make you competitive these days when you are faced with teams that have full squad tumbling. I'm interested to see if they are restating this to emphasize it and de-value tumbling for the next year... If my team only needs half + 1 to max out instead of full team tumbling and stunts are worth more anyways, this completely changes try outs.

 

[Cheerfan1234]

Well it would be helpful to get clarification on this because if a small team with 11 beautiful tumblers will get the same score as a team with 20 tumblers or in large a team with 19 awesome tumblers versus 36, then this is going to change the game for a lot of tryouts over the next month and a half!

 

[CGAcheer]

that piece just standardized it, there were some companies where you needed 75% some where you needed squad minus 1-3 depending on size and some are half +1 and others just counted the total skills thrown.

but its not like it truly makes a difference a team with squad tumbling with excellent execution is going to score higher than a team with half +1 with excellent execution

 

[JulieP]

I don't know where you're from, but my only thought is that maybe your team was outscored because the team with only half+1 had better overall technique than your full squad tumbling?

I was always under the impression that half +1 getting you into the max range was the standard rule of thumb for a few years now, so I'm confused as to why the USASF just released this as something new for 2012-2013. Can someone explain/clarify?

If this is now going to be truly enforced, I'm sure their reasoning is to level the playing field (especially because of the dying Senior Large Level 5 division) but also to encourage teams to focus more on technique over quantity, which I think is a good thing ONLY if the teams with better technique are rewarded accordingly even if they have less tumbling than their competition.

We were outscored in both execution and percentage of team performing the skill. Tell me how that makes sense?

 

[cupieqt]

We were outscored in both execution and percentage of team performing the skill. Tell me how that makes sense?

And I've seen your team tumble. Their technique and execution is very good.

 

[yojaehs]

Just curious if where USASF or EP's would like for tumbling coaches to work? Seems like they are trying more and more to put me out of a job.