All-Star Illegal Elements (just To Raise Awareness)

[addicted2cheer]

I'm just a nobody excheer mom of a girl who no longer cheers but LOVE to come on here and youtube and watch videos of all these amazing teams. I have this question to pose... Even IF this was a private showcase having nothing to do with the judging or competitive world shouldn't teams only be doing or practicing stunts that are Legal and allowed within the realm of the USASF? Although I don't know all the ins and outs of the USASF and their rules, my understanding of the purpose for them is to establish guidelines within the sport to keep our children safe and not performing stunts and skills that could be more dangerous than what they are already expected to do. I just don't understand how it's only a showcase is an answer for an athlete doing such a dangerous skill. I know how many weeks and weeks it would take my daughter's teams back in the day to master a pyramid I don't know why they would work so hard on skills like that before the season starts if they are not legal. My daughter's teams used to goof around at the end of the season and maybe make up stunts and pyramids at the END of the season but never during the season and always with sanctioned skills.

 

[ztaprincess]

Everyone was all over Gym Tyme last year when they had a stunt that many thought were illegal but no one said "well why don't you ask James yourself instead of discussing it here". Instead many people were up in arms because it was dangerous. Now that Rich and SEVERAL others have brought it to people's attention that CEA has several things in their routines that are illegal or at least performed illegally then it shouldn't be discussed? These things are just as dangerous as any other stunt that is called out and discussed so get over it. Sorry but if you are going to get onto Rich for calling out illegalities then point fingers at the others who have posted on here that it is illegal as well. Heck Rich didn't even make this thread but you are still attacking him.

These attacks on people for calling out a team that you love is becoming rather annoying and not needed at all. This thread is nice to have because there are some people that had no idea something like that was illegal but now that they can see it they will know that it is a no no and shouldn't be done.

 

[laughAlittle]

Everyone was all over Gym Tyme last year when they had a stunt that many thought were illegal but no one said "well why don't you ask James yourself instead of discussing it here". Instead many people were up in arms because it was dangerous. Now that Rich and SEVERAL others have brought it to people's attention that CEA has several things in their routines that are illegal or at least performed illegally then it shouldn't be discussed? These things are just as dangerous as any other stunt that is called out and discussed so get over it. Sorry but if you are going to get onto Rich for calling out illegalities then point fingers at the others who have posted on here that it is illegal as well. Heck Rich didn't even make this thread but you are still attacking him.

These attacks on people for calling out a team that you love is becoming rather annoying and not needed at all. This thread is nice to have because there are some people that had no idea something like that was illegal but now that they can see it they will know that it is a no no and shouldn't be done.

I think you just took the words out of everybody's mouth! thankyou!

 

[wcdad]

Everyone was all over Gym Tyme last year when they had a stunt that many thought were illegal but no one said "well why don't you ask James yourself instead of discussing it here". Instead many people were up in arms because it was dangerous. Now that Rich and SEVERAL others have brought it to people's attention that CEA has several things in their routines that are illegal or at least performed illegally then it shouldn't be discussed? These things are just as dangerous as any other stunt that is called out and discussed so get over it. Sorry but if you are going to get onto Rich for calling out illegalities then point fingers at the others who have posted on here that it is illegal as well. Heck Rich didn't even make this thread but you are still attacking him.

These attacks on people for calling out a team that you love is becoming rather annoying and not needed at all. This thread is nice to have because there are some people that had no idea something like that was illegal but now that they can see it they will know that it is a no no and shouldn't be done.

I was going to bring up the GT Black Stunt last year that went on for months. And GT did go through the proccess to make sure it was leagal abd was ready for NCA because of this Forum and the conversations that went on. But you beat me to it..

 

[socratesofcheer]

I'm curious as to why the excuse of "it's not a competition, it's our showcase" has anything to do with anything.
Clearly, if you are going to put an element in a routine, it's there for competition purposes.
Otherwise, why in the world waste time practicing the illegal element if you "know" it's illegal?

 

[MomentumToni]

How on earth are we ever going to progress the sport and our skills if we can't innovate and try new things in our own gym environments and with coaches like Courtney? Surely there was a time that cheerleaders and coaches couldn't imagine tick-tocks or back tuck baskets, not to mention 360 ball ups ... but now they're as common in our gyms and at our competitions as a lawn gnome in the suburbs.
I think everyone needs to chill out and trust that the coaches know the capabilities of their athletes.

I coach a level 2 team but I know some of my girls are far more capable then the rest of the squad and so I take those girls to camps for higher levels to keep them excited about the sport and keen to innovate and work alongside their teammates on level 2. It's pretty much the same thing CEA are doing here. It's for the athletes and their families and friends... yes, it should be made clear that it's illegal to compete but there's no need for mud slinging and overreaction.

 

[UnfadedSprkl]

How on earth are we ever going to progress the sport and our skills if we can't innovate and try new things in our own gym environments and with coaches like Courtney? Surely there was a time that cheerleaders and coaches couldn't imagine tick-tocks or back tuck baskets, not to mention 360 ball ups ... but now they're as common in our gyms and at our competitions as a lawn gnome in the suburbs.
I think everyone needs to chill out and trust that the coaches know the capabilities of their athletes.

I coach a level 2 team but I know some of my girls are far more capable then the rest of the squad and so I take those girls to camps for higher levels to keep them excited about the sport and keen to innovate and work alongside their teammates on level 2. It's pretty much the same thing CEA are doing here. It's for the athletes and their families and friends... yes, it should be made clear that it's illegal to compete but there's no need for mud slinging and overreaction.

I have to respectfully disagree. Tick Tocks and 360 ball ups have been legal for a long time, and prior to them being illegal (at the HS level), high schools were performing them in the early 2000's. Back tuck baskets for high school aged athletes have been illegal as long as I've been a cheerleader, coach and/or safety judge. As the sport evolves, so do the rules. Prior to last year, 'live animals' and 'fire' were not mentioned as items that could not be put on the mat as a prop. Obviously the rules committee decided this was a safety issue. Does this mean that just because we are at practice and at showcase, that we should allow our athletes to use poms that at a certain point in the routine burst into flames for effect?

Preparing level 2 athletes for level 3 skills is alot different than doing stunts that are illegal at Levels 1-5. Would you teach your Senior Level 2 athletes a back tuck basket just because their straight ride is high enough?

There is a difference between progression and putting your athletes in danger...and coaches should know not to cross that line.

 

[UnfadedSprkl]

And just to say...I am not saying Courtney intentionally put any athletes in danger...I am just saying that there is a difference between progression and putting illegal skills out for showcase or fun.

 

[kristenthegreat]

...I'd just like to reiterate my post above, in case others missed it: At least 2 previously illegal/borderline illegal moves are now in the rules as legal elements- prone landings and assisted tumbling. Just thought I'd throw that out there.

 

[ztaprincess]

...I'd just like to reiterate my post above, in case others missed it: At least 2 previously illegal/borderline illegal moves are now in the rules as legal elements- prone landings and assisted tumbling. Just thought I'd throw that out there.

I believe the prone landings things wasn't exactly added the rule was just rewritten to be understood better. Gym Tyme performed it last year legally but people weren't interpreting it differently so it was rewritten to be clear what it meant.

As for coaches practicing things that are illegal on purpose I don't think it should be done. I can link it to a thread where someone said that after seeing the teams from Japan do crazy stunts and pyramids that the US teams better be doing things like it. The thought of a coach doing what they do here in the US scares the crap out of me. They normally do not have the correct amount of spotters to make things legal here in the US. If a gym here in the US decided to do what they saw on a youtube video that was illegal according to the USASF and someone got hurt what would people say a bout that gym owner or coach? If CEA performs that pyramid at a competition and that flyers gets injured will that change people's opinions of performing illegal skills?

 

[imrichhowboutu]

Does anyone know if the USASF catastrophic insurance covers accidents resulting from illegal skills?

 

[wcdad]

Does anyone know if the USASF catastrophic insurance covers accidents resulting from illegal skills?

To be honest I don't know what it covers. I have been trying to get information on it and have been coming up empty. If any one has s link please post

 

[DJ]

Does anyone know if the USASF catastrophic insurance covers accidents resulting from illegal skills?

To be honest I don't know what it covers. I have been trying to get information on it and have been coming up empty. If any one has s link please post

Great to see the gangs all back!

 

[wcdad]

Great to see the gangs all back!

For the record I have posted this question several times. I have been trying to get information on the policy and have yet to find any.

 

[MissBee]

Does anyone know if the USASF catastrophic insurance covers accidents resulting from illegal skills?

The way I understood it, no. You are covered if you have taken all reasonable precautions (properly matted surface, progressions taught, safety rules followed) but if you know the rules and break the rules they don't get your back.