High School Nca Vs Uca Coed Stunting

[Cavan]

So obviously we all see that NCA and UCA college nationals both put heavy emphasis on true coed stunting that is a basic requirement to score well in their coed divisions, but correct if i'm off or way off but i've never seen true coed stunting done in NCA HS nationals or nothing more than assisted two based stunts, like at all! If anyone has vids though yall pls link them i'd love to see some true coed stunting at NCA. UCA HS does actually have their coed teams make the guys coed stunt and it is required to score well in those coed divisions. I'm pretty sure NCA divisions allow coed stunting because both cheer companies are under the AACCA. Does anybody else think that this is maybe because of the "flashier" all star nature of NCA while UCA has the more traditional gameday part of it where coed stunting is big.

 

[ScottyB]

So obviously we all see that NCA and UCA college nationals both put heavy emphasis on true coed stunting that is a basic requirement to score well in their coed divisions, but correct if i'm off or way off but i've never seen true coed stunting done in NCA HS nationals or nothing more than assisted two based stunts, like at all! If anyone has vids though yall pls link them i'd love to see some true coed stunting at NCA. UCA HS does actually have their coed teams make the guys coed stunt and it is required to score well in those coed divisions. I'm pretty sure NCA divisions allow coed stunting because both cheer companies are under the AACCA. Does anybody else think that this is maybe because of the "flashier" all star nature of NCA while UCA has the more traditional gameday part of it where coed stunting is big.

Both companies are under Varsity Spirit (AACCA is the Safety Group).

Because both NCA and UCA offer the same products (camps, clinics, and competitions) they have to differentiate the two to keep the two inner companies competitive. One is flashier, one is more structured. One is focus on the excitement, one is on the spirit. Lots of differences on the surface level.

I agree with you that the NCA HS side of coed stunting or even just legit single based stunting is weaker. I am not sure if that is a culture thing or a scoresheet thing.

 

[Cavan]

Both companies are under Varsity Spirit (AACCA is the Safety Group).

Because both NCA and UCA offer the same products (camps, clinics, and competitions) they have to differentiate the two to keep the two inner companies competitive. One is flashier, one is more structured. One is focus on the excitement, one is on the spirit. Lots of differences on the surface level.

I agree with you that the NCA HS side of coed stunting or even just legit single based stunting is weaker. I am not sure if that is a culture thing or a scoresheet thing.

Oh yeah I knew that I just meant since both have to follow the same safety rules there's nothing stopping advanced coed divisions at NCA from doing the same type of stunting allowed at UCA varsity coed divisions. It just makes it pointless to have coed divisons at NCA at all because I've seen it where the winning all girl advanced small division for example is more elite than the winning small coed advanced division. It's just another division for coaches to take of advantage of so their team can win.

 

[OldskoolKYcheercoach]

Both companies are under Varsity Spirit (AACCA is the Safety Group).

Because both NCA and UCA offer the same products (camps, clinics, and competitions) they have to differentiate the two to keep the two inner companies competitive. One is flashier, one is more structured. One is focus on the excitement, one is on the spirit. Lots of differences on the surface level.

I agree with you that the NCA HS side of coed stunting or even just legit single based stunting is weaker. I am not sure if that is a culture thing or a scoresheet thing.

Culture thing...

Been that way since at least the early 90's when I was making my rounds through high school cheer.

All the way down to when I first found out NCA was even a thing and said something about it at practice, the other guys on the team said "hell no."

 

[Official OWECheer]

Culture thing...

Been that way since at least the early 90's when I was making my rounds through high school cheer.

All the way down to when I first found out NCA was even a thing and said something about it at practice, the other guys on the team said "hell no."

As in, you suggested that you guys go to NCA?

 

[OldskoolKYcheercoach]

As in, you suggested that you guys go to NCA?

No, I just asked what it was...we are talking a year after I started cheer, all I knew existed was UCA. Then I saw something with NCA on it.

 

[Official OWECheer]

No, I just asked what it was...we are talking a year after I started cheer, all I knew existed was UCA. Then I saw something with NCA on it.

I though that the lack of true coed stunts at NCA was only a recent thing. Maybe I haven't watched enough old NCA videos of coed teams.

 

[OldskoolKYcheercoach]

I though that the lack of true coed stunts at NCA was only a recent thing. Maybe I haven't watched enough old NCA videos of coed teams.

In all fairness, their "hell no" could have been because of the need for us to jump and dance at NCA. I was very, very new to the game at the time.

I don't know that I've ever seen a video of NCA from that time frame.

There were two things that we held pretty dear as male cheerleaders in my high school at the time: we were not going to be doing any dancing or jumping, and we would not be using any help to keep our stunts in the air.

I don't know if NCA violated one of those "rules," the other, or both.

 

[Official OWECheer]

In all fairness, their "hell no" could have been because of the need for us to jump and dance at NCA. I was very, very new to the game at the time.

I don't know that I've ever seen a video of NCA from that time frame.

There were two things that we held pretty dear as male cheerleaders in my high school at the time: we were not going to be doing any dancing or jumping, and we would not be using any help to keep our stunts in the air.

I don't know if NCA violated one of those "rules," the other, or both.

There must have been a culture change w/ UCA from the 80s to 90s; I've seen male cheerleaders dance in UCA routines (Losal is a notable favorite of mine) from the 80s but not in the 90s.

 

[AndyT_T]

Its largely because of the demographic they each market their coed divisions to:
-NCA has generally been pretty okay with coed divisions growing, shrinking, growing again, disappearing all together, etc.
-UCA has generally worked VERY hard to keep boys in the sport and to make sure the sport appeals to boys (For better or for worse).
For the most part it worked (UCA HS nationals has a much higher percentage of coed teams compared to NCA), but in order to make it happen they had to change a lot about the sport (like getting rid of dance and jumps in coed divisions). They also made tumbling a smaller part of the score sheet and changed how it is scored compared to NCA/All Star, a move which I think was done specifically so teams with a lot of bigger boys who could partner stunt but can't tumble would be successful.
In contrast NCA never removed the emphasis on tumbling and that means (usually) that for a large coed team to be successful they need boys who can partner stunt AND tumble It is much easier to find a boy who can do one or the other (or a boy who can group stunt/two man and tumble).

It's also hard to gauge because UCA high school nationals is MUCH larger than NCA (I think because of Disney), but I believe NCA College nationals is bigger than UCA. So do you really see more UCA high school boys partner stunting, or is it just that you never really see NCA coed teams in high school?

 

[coacha]

It's also hard to gauge because UCA high school nationals is MUCH larger than NCA (I think because of Disney), but I believe NCA College nationals is bigger than UCA. So do you really see more UCA high school boys partner stunting, or is it just that you never really see NCA coed teams in high school?

I don't know about other people, but I personally would be happy if UCA nationals didn't happen at Disney. We are UCA, for better or worse, because it fits our high school crowd leading style much better than NCA. It has absolutely nothing to do with the location of nationals for us. It's simply an extension of what I feel as a coach is the proper emphasis for a high school team.

 

[OldskoolKYcheercoach]

I don't know about other people, but I personally would be happy if UCA nationals didn't happen at Disney. We are UCA, for better or worse, because it fits our high school crowd leading style much better than NCA. It has absolutely nothing to do with the location of nationals for us. It's simply an extension of what I feel as a coach is the proper emphasis for a high school team.

Agree 100%

If I could get the same level of competition without having to fight to keep my team focused on the competition and less on space mountain we'd be there in a heartbeat.

 

[AndyT_T]

I don't know about other people, but I personally would be happy if UCA nationals didn't happen at Disney. We are UCA, for better or worse, because it fits our high school crowd leading style much better than NCA. It has absolutely nothing to do with the location of nationals for us. It's simply an extension of what I feel as a coach is the proper emphasis for a high school team.

I agree for my school as well. But I think if NCA was at Disney Land or something it would be much more popular.
In many states, teams have to rework their routine to go to nationals because UCA style is different than their state's style while NCA would fit it more closely, but they rework and go to UCA nationals anyways. I also know personally of a lot of teams (especially those who aren't the most competitive) who go to UCA for the "Nationals experience", and I think Disney is a big draw for that.
I'm not saying that that doesn't mean there aren't teams that go to UCA because it fits their team, but there are teams that go because it's the "Disney Nationals" instead of the "Dallas Nationals" (I have literally heard them called that more than once).

 

[mncheerqueen]

In my opinion going for the experience at UCA is good maybe every two years but forcing athletes to pay all the costs for it every year when they know they aren't going to be competitive really irks me. It is very popular thing to do in our state and honestly isn't worth it to me if you've gone to UCA 5 years in a row "for the experience" and never made it past prelims. Going every two or every other year just for "experience" I could possibly see but not every year.

 

[ScottyB]

It's also hard to gauge because UCA high school nationals is MUCH larger than NCA (I think because of Disney), but I believe NCA College nationals is bigger than UCA. So do you really see more UCA high school boys partner stunting, or is it just that you never really see NCA coed teams in high school?

I think it's because the style/culture, not Disney. With disney you get more cost and expense, people definitely are not lining up just for disney. Also UCA HS Nationals is a prestigious high school event recognized by the NFHS, and has been going for decades so there is tradition around "NHSCC" for teams regardless the location (being that it used to be at SeaWorld and was still a popular mainstay)

Additionally, more ADs and Principals support the UCA version of HS Spirit due to the focus on fundamental crowdleading being at the core: which is what ADs/Principals want if they are funding/insuring a cheer squad.