All-Star Not Agreeing With Your Scores....what Do You Do??

[jenniferinwv]

Unfortunately, I think this is one of the major issues that keeps cheerleading from being considered a "sport"...these inconsistencies in scoring.

 

[nvecchioni89]

I know I am very disappointed with BATC, scoring and overall. Yikes.

 

[KRECCheer]

I know I am very disappointed with BATC, scoring and overall. Yikes.

My mouth still hangs open in shock over their scoring.

 

[kristenthegreat]

Dear Battle at the Capitol,
Your 'seeming' inconsistencies in scoring are making your competition look poorly run and possibly shady. I suggest if you would like more participants at your events, that you start releasing scores or add some note of transparency to your system. You are potentially driving customers away. Just giving you the 'heads up.'
Regards,
Me. Knowing full well you'll never read this.

 

[KRECCheer]

Dear Battle at the Capitol,
Your 'seeming' inconsistencies in scoring are making your competition look poorly run and possibly shady. I suggest if you would like more participants at your events, that you start releasing scores or add some note of transparency to your system. You are potentially driving customers away. Just giving you the 'heads up.'
Regards,
Me. Knowing full well you'll never read this.

Dear Battle,
When you hire a judge to answer questions when picking up scores, make sure he or she knows the rules of each level and don't offer silly suggestions to up our scores when those things aren't even allowed in my specific level. And maybe hire staff members that dont fall asleep in the coaches VIP room?

Sincerely,
Someone who is still in shock.

 

[nvecchioni89]

Also, just a random side note. I am not going to post ALL the complaints I had (seriously a novel). For Small Gym Battle, they advertised winning jackets (as you would assume with it still being a national, and still being called Battle at the Capitol), and handed out pretty lame hoodies. Not taking away from the teams who got hoodies, they just looked like the ones you could buy, and IMO I think the winning teams did a fantastic job this weekend, and I think you should have all recieved the JACKETS that were advertised. We did ask about this at the competition, and we were told "It's a completely different event, a different venue, lower fees, and we never advertised jackets. Plus it is only rec and school anyway". Thank you Coastal employees, for really showing how important us small gyms are. I did go on and check their website this morning and did in fact, see the word jackets. Winners, I would say fight for what your kids worked so hard for, and what they do deserve. Saw lots of talent this weekend, great showing from all.

Im just still in such a bad mood from this event. Well, all costal events really. Maybe I will make a venting thread to get the full word out. I have never seen a company just not care the way Coastal does about their customers. Im going to stop before this ends up being another novel.

 

[nvecchioni89]

Dear Battle,
When you hire a judge to answer questions when picking up scores, make sure he or she knows the rules of each level and don't offer silly suggestions to up our scores when those things aren't even allowed in my specific level. And maybe hire staff members that dont fall asleep in the coaches VIP room?

Sincerely,
Someone who is still in shock.

Oh yes, how the release moves can go either way as far as difficulty or LTD. Those darn release moves....for level 1. *rolls eyes* And by the time I got to the coaches room...there was a jar of peanut butter. Delicious lunch for me!

 

[KRECCheer]

Oh yes, how the release moves can go either way as far as difficulty or LTD. Those darn release moves....for level 1. *rolls eyes* And by the time I got to the coaches room...there was a jar of peanut butter. Delicious lunch for me!

Our level 1 tinys did a twisting dismount! I never knew my coaches taught my 3 and 4 year olds how to do that...

 

[Rudags]

I typically talk to the EP/Head Judge. If I don't like their response - I simply don't go back. With that said - If I ever have any say in the matter - I will NEVER step foot back in an Athletic Championships. Its one thing to admit your scoring was wrong, or a mistake. Ill take that and probably return to the event for a second chance - However, if you feed me a line of B.S. - Good luck keeping your little rink dink local regional 1-day comp. alive....

 

[nvecchioni89]

I typically talk to the EP/Head Judge. If I don't like their response - I simply don't go back. With that said - If I ever have any say in the matter - I will NEVER step foot back in an Athletic Championships. Its one thing to admit your scoring was wrong, or a mistake. Ill take that and probably return to the event for a second chance - However, if you feed me a line of B.S. - Good luck keeping your little rink dink local regional 1-day comp. alive....

Yeah im not a fan of a bunch of B.S. I'd love to know how difficulty, LTD, and quantity scores can change from day 1 to day 2, competing the SAME routine, nothing was added/taken out, and with the SAME judging panel both days. I figured things that would change would be technique/execution can of course vary, overall impressions, and of course any deductions. I mean I could be confused on scoring I guess. Though I would assume if you dont add additional difficulty from day 1 to day 2 (why would you?!), then that score should be consistant (provided your stunts arent crumbling to the ground).

 

[Rudags]

Yeah im not a fan of a bunch of B.S. I'd love to know how difficulty, LTD, and quantity scores can change from day 1 to day 2, competing the SAME routine, nothing was added/taken out, and with the SAME judging panel both days. I figured things that would change would be technique/execution can of course vary, overall impressions, and of course any deductions. I mean I could be confused on scoring I guess. Though I would assume if you dont add additional difficulty from day 1 to day 2 (why would you?!), then that score should be consistant (provided your stunts arent crumbling to the ground).

Yes. Im aware. Last year I was at a UCA Regional Competition. We went because it was $35/athlete and about two weeks before a Worlds bid Comp. There was us, one other smaller program, and a bunch of rec teams. We got beat by a team who was missing a flyer (so marked their pyramid, one stunt, and holes all over) and had several busts and pyramid fall and we hit clean. We argued with the stunt judge about our range we were in for stunts because we did switch ups and her response (non exaggerated, and a true quote): "Whats a switch up? Im just a High School Coach. I don't see Allstar teams and have never judged an Allstar Competition. They had a judge cancel so called me last minute. Let me get someone else to help you"
:jawdrop:

 

[hopskipandjump]

Yes. Im aware. Last year I was at a UCA Regional Competition. We went because it was $35/athlete and about two weeks before a Worlds bid Comp. There was us, one other smaller program, and a bunch of rec teams. We got beat by a team who was missing a flyer (so marked their pyramid, one stunt, and holes all over) and had several busts and pyramid fall and we hit clean. We argued with the stunt judge about our range we were in for stunts because we did switch ups and her response (non exaggerated, and a true quote): "Whats a switch up? Im just a High School Coach. I don't see Allstar teams and have never judged an Allstar Competition. They had a judge cancel so called me last minute. Let me get someone else to help you"
:jawdrop:

omg

 

[Rudags]

omg

Right? The team that beat us also got a Full Paid Bid to All Levels or something. They did correct our score (after several weeks of emails) and sent us a trophy and also offered to pay for our 4's to go to All Levels or whatever it was. However, The fact remains our kids thought their routine sucked because they got beat, the parents questioned why we attended the event, and it really can become a PR nightmare. Saint Louis has hardly any local comps and no Worlds bid Comps because no one attends. Athletic Championships used to be a HUGE TWO day Event in STL. Gymtyme use to come along with gyms from all over the Midwest, and even the South. It was a 7AM-10PM comp at one point. Now Its about a 10AM-2PM comp. People don't attend because how political it seemed to be. I know every coach complains about 'politics' when they don't win, but as someone that is pretty dead on with results and knows what I should and shouldn't be scoring - and even being out of the area now so I have no biases - We were screwed by teams who brought in more money to the competition. Back in 2006 I was 'judges runner' as my college helped staff the event. I heard an owner of a gym complain that ONE SIDE of their pyramid fell because they couldn't hear the music, and if they didnt remove the deduction - he would not bring is 200-something gym next year.... Lets just say that 200-something gym still attends.... Politics in this sport can really SUCK. I get it, its a business if your in an area failing for competition, you gotta do what you gotta do, but Im telling you, its not always conspiracy theories..... sometimes stuff really happens.

My favorite that I have posted on another thread a long time ago was when I confronted an EP about scores. Day 1 was a stretch to stretch, full up, double. We had one stunt fall. It was our first comp, and the stunts were all a little bobbley. We were working stretch to stretch 1.5 up, but they weren't quite ready. I was like "Eh, were no winning so lets just throw it" Day 2 we put in our more advanced stunts. The same stunt fell on Day 2, but the rest hit. Execution wise was VERY SIMILAR. We did scores similar execution scores, but our stunt difficulty dropped .7. I talked to the EP after and he told me that next time I do a major change, I need to come up and let the judges know to look for it so they don't miss it. I disagree with that response completely, and again, won't take any of my teams back. They even offered for us to go for free just to have more teams at the event.... I said NO!

 

[IMISSCHEER]

Dear Battle at the Capitol,
Your 'seeming' inconsistencies in scoring are making your competition look poorly run and possibly shady. I suggest if you would like more participants at your events, that you start releasing scores or add some note of transparency to your system. You are potentially driving customers away. Just giving you the 'heads up.'
Regards,
Me. Knowing full well you'll never read this.

The drama at Battle every year is NOT worth it. I don't mind spending the money and going to a competition that is worthy, but as a parent I want what I pay for...to be judged Fairly. At Jamfest, Indy, we scored alot higher then we did at Battle with the same score sheet and we had 2 PERFECT routines back to back. It doesn't make sense and when no answers are given by the reps it is total disrespect to the coaches, athletes, and the parents. It's all about the money, once they got you there NO ONE CARES but the coaches!!!!!

 

[hopskipandjump]

"its not always conspiracy theories..... sometimes stuff really happens." Could not agree more. And frankly, it happens more than sometimes. I feel like an idiot or a sore loser or whatever when I bring something to the attention of an EP, but my points are valid, as are yours. Most who coach have a pretty good idea of how teams should place; especially if you are going against teams whose difficulty has not been maxed out, yours has and if they didn't hit a clean routine, but you did. I can accept defeat being beaten by a better team. I have a harder time when uninformed judging beats me.

And yeah, I ALWAYS tell the judges what they should be looking for before my teams compete. sheesh....