All-Star Only Seniors Can Expose Midriff???

[yojaehs]

To me it's just a uniform, I really don't care what's worn. However after reading and hearing years of this negativity, what is the legitimate argument that going to a full cover uniform is bad? It might be different for a year or two but really has anyone won or lost a competition because they showed their shoulders or stomach? I mean common guys it's a uniform, if covering up will calm everyone down, I'm all for it.

 

[Cody Z.]

Way too much thought.

 

[Mom2Cheergirls]

The parents on the PAC handle all the publicity and we posted the recrutiment here on Fierceboard (Cheer Parents Online Section), on Twitter, and on our PAC Facebook page.

See and I did not know there was a PAC Facebook page. Thank you very much again for the info.

 

[cupieqt]

I resent being lumped into the 'disagreeing' viewpoint as the 'Full-Top Gang.' I'm already a member of the Teal Army and the Bra Brigade. There's a two-army limit in The Grand Dominion of KristentheGreat and I've already met my quota, please and thank you.

I don't even like full tops (crop tops!! Love em!) but my gym wears them for various reasons. Don't put me in the "full top gang" either. I like a good healthy debate and I want to hear from both sides. I think insulting anyone that doesn't hold a particular view does nothing to contribute to the conversation. I can't take name callers arguments seriously.

 

[flcheermom]

I don't even like full tops (crop tops!! Love em!) but my gym wears them for various reasons. Don't put me in the "full top gang" either. I like a good healthy debate and I want to hear from both sides. I think insulting anyone that doesn't hold a particular view does nothing to contribute to the conversation. I can't take name callers arguments seriously.

Our gym wears crop tops -I also like them... because I agree there needs to be uniform guidelines -I hope that doesn't make me part of the full top gang. Lol. I agree with you about the name calling. I was trying to state that having uniform guidelines is not out of the norm -we are a sport- some may not like it -but guidelines had to be set.

 

[MomMomMamaMom]

Actually, it was 4 athletes that Happy gained to his program after the Image Policy was first released. And that isn't BS. Amy's point wasn't that Happy's customers like it, it was that the Image Policy has already been effective in reaching its goal: to grow the market and to attract more athletes to all star cheerleading.
The goal is to make all star cheer more universally appealing. No single resolve from the policy solves the issue, but when they are all put into practice, the change is notable. Crop tops weren't picked on because they are inappropriate (at least it's not my opinion that they are inappropriate). They were just the easiest target when looking for a standard uniform piece to regulate.
I think where we don't see eye to eye is on the position of choice. You feel like your choice to wear crop tops were taken away. And I see it as there are still plenty of choices when selecting a uniform, even if crop top designs for Juniors, Youth, Minis, and Tiny's are out of the equation. I respect you and the points you've made. And more than anything else, I appreciate your passion.

But wouldn't Happy have gained those same four customers if he had chosen on his own to wear crop tops? I don't get attributing it to the new policy, unless the theory is that these customers would have an impression that all cheerleaders wore crop tops if they saw other teams wearing them. Which then begs the question of why more gyms weren't wearing full tops in the first place. If the overwhelming majority liked the full tops, then I'm not sure this would be an issue, because the overwhelming majority would , in theory, be wearing the full tops, and attracting their customers that way.

I guess I get the lets clean up our image argument, and as I've said before, I am sure there are more people who would not do cheer due to crop tops than there will be due to full tops...but it still leaves the issue of who it is we are trying to please? Are we trying to be universally appealing so that more people will cheer, or so that more people will take cheer seriously? Because if you really want more people to cheer, regulating the cost of cheer might be more effective.....if we are trying to be taken more seriously, than the universal scoring, independent governing body thing still stands in the way.

Don't get me wrong...I'm not bucking the change per se, but I remain skeptical as to who this is benefiting.

 

[ASCheerMan]

But wouldn't Happy have gained those same four customers if he had chosen on his own to wear crop tops? I don't get attributing it to the new policy, unless the theory is that these customers would have an impression that all cheerleaders wore crop tops if they saw other teams wearing them. Which then begs the question of why more gyms weren't wearing full tops in the first place. If the overwhelming majority liked the full tops, then I'm not sure this would be an issue, because the overwhelming majority would , in theory, be wearing the full tops, and attracting their customers that way.

Don't get me wrong...I'm not bucking the change per se, but I remain skeptical as to who this is benefiting.

We attribute the 4 athletes to the Image Policy because those 4 athletes told Happy it was the policy that made them decide to join.

I don't know that an overwhelming majority are not in favor of the policy. The naysayers are known for being more expressive and more vocal. But after every USASF Regional Meeting where this topic is presented, I am met by 7 to 10 coaches who didn't feel comfortable speaking up during the presentation, but want to personally thank the USASF for taking a stance.

All that said, the Image Policy and crop top rule wasn't put in place under the premise that a majority of our constituents were in favor of full tops. It was put in place to address bigger picture issues. And just like with our country's government, there are some polices/rules/laws that don't go before the general public for vote.

 

[Deleted member 1556]

I like full tops. I get sick of seeing belly buttons after a while.

 

[mollymags]

I wouldn't imagine that having to wear full tops will drive anyone to stop cheering. If you're here only for the crop tops, well, you're here for the wrong reasons.

I do, however, see more parents/athletes willing to start all-star cheerleading if more people are in full tops. I'm sure that the idea of crop tops drives people away. People involved in all-star cheerleading look at what we're doing as an athletic endeavor... because it is. But I would bet you that the VAST majority of "outsiders" look at what our athletes are wearing and are assuming that what we're doing is more similar to a beauty pageant than a gymnastics meet.

I never, ever would have been comfortable in a full top and that was a HUGE factor in which gym I chose to cheer at. If there were no gyms in my area that met my needs while wearing full tops, I would have most likely left all-stars.

The USASF is trying to drive more people into our sport. Don't you want more competition?

There are plenty of people that like full tops. I've worked at events in parts of the country where only 1 or 2 programs would be wearing crop tops, so I would definitely say that in some places, full tops are absolutely the norm. Just because most Senior 5's aren't wearing full tops doesn't mean that a good chunk of the rest of the industry isn't either.

The hair and makeup and uniforms are fun, but they're not everything. You're not getting your rights completely stripped away. In a few years, this will be in place, and you'll forget about it. But until then, maybe everyone should throw on a t-shirt or tank top and figure out how to tumble in an ever so restricting full length top.

 

[Coach Troy]

I wouldn't imagine that having to wear full tops will drive anyone to stop cheering. If you're here only for the crop tops, well, you're here for the wrong reasons.

I do, however, see more parents/athletes willing to start all-star cheerleading if more people are in full tops. I'm sure that the idea of crop tops drives people away. People involved in all-star cheerleading look at what we're doing as an athletic endeavor... because it is. But I would bet you that the VAST majority of "outsiders" look at what our athletes are wearing and are assuming that what we're doing is more similar to a beauty pageant than a gymnastics meet.

I never, ever would have been comfortable in a full top and that was a HUGE factor in which gym I chose to cheer at. If there were no gyms in my area that met my needs while wearing full tops, I would have most likely left all-stars.
quote]

These two statments kind of conrtidict eachother don't you think???

With that being said I have seen the sport grow tremendously since I started in 1997 and It grew with people wearing crop tops, full tops, 3/4 tops, etc. It grows because we the gym owners love what we do and we market and grow our buisness. There are dads that don't let there kids do gymnastics because of the leo, there are mom's that don't let thier boys do football because it's dangerous, there are parents that choose no sports because they are not athletic...
This image rule is designed to "make the outside world" and some "dad that doesnt like the uniform, makeup, dance moves, etc" think better of us. I have never defended or had to sell my buisness to a dad due to clothing choices.... rather it is the dad with no boys that needs his daughter to do soccer or softball or volleyball NOT because of uniform but because he understands those sports!!!

This is the wrong way to build an industry like ours. We must understand that just like in any buisness we won't apeal to everyone and to have a model of "be all things to all people" is a recipe for desaster. It is far better to have a diverse population which will attract by its very nature MORE CUSTOMERS!!!!

 

[Coach Troy]

Actually, it was 4 athletes that Happy gained to his program after the Image Policy was first released. And that isn't BS. Amy's point wasn't that Happy's customers like it, it was that the Image Policy has already been effective in reaching its goal: to grow the market and to attract more athletes to all star cheerleading.
The goal is to make all star cheer more universally appealing. No single resolve from the policy solves the issue, but when they are all put into practice, the change is notable. Crop tops weren't picked on because they are inappropriate (at least it's not my opinion that they are inappropriate). They were just the easiest target when looking for a standard uniform piece to regulate.
I think where we don't see eye to eye is on the position of choice. You feel like your choice to wear crop tops were taken away. And I see it as there are still plenty of choices when selecting a uniform, even if crop top designs for Juniors, Youth, Minis, and Tiny's are out of the equation. I respect you and the points you've made. And more than anything else, I appreciate your passion.

Again I maintain you do not have any numbers to say that cheer isnt attracting new people. I actually could give you data that says well run gyms are attracting new clientle on a regular basis. I have one of my locations that just added 35 new members this month. Not a school , Not a pop warner or rec team but 35 new clients that were gymnasts, soccer players, etc that are deciding to try cheer.

In my market we have a full top gym and a half top gym (ME) and we both are doing well. Some undoubtably choose gyms based on uniforms but the great thing is all those customers had choices!! In our industry I would think diversity and choice would be the vehicle for growth.... that is why I believe very strongly that these "moral high horse"" arguments are just a facade. That this decision was based on a flawed premis and just the desire of individuals withing an organization that knows we have no where to go .......

 

[yojaehs]

Ok so full tops gain people and DON'T lose people and crop tops may or may not lose people from cheer. No brainer, full tops. Ok, next debate.

 

[Coach Troy]

I do not believe that you have any evidence for this claim. I further think that a simple look at the past few years speaks to the affirmative that diversity in the industry is a better vehilce for growth.

 

[MomMomMamaMom]

Ok so full tops gain people and DON'T lose people and crop tops may or may not lose people from cheer. No brainer, full tops. Ok, next debate.

Ahh I suppose you are right...but I'm still trying to figure out who we are pleasing and why were getting rid of crop tops instead of containing costs....

 

[MomMomMamaMom]

We attribute the 4 athletes to the Image Policy because those 4 athletes told Happy it was the policy that made them decide to join.

I don't know that an overwhelming majority are not in favor of the policy. The naysayers are known for being more expressive and more vocal. But after every USASF Regional Meeting where this topic is presented, I am met by 7 to 10 coaches who didn't feel comfortable speaking up during the presentation, but want to personally thank the USASF for taking a stance.

All that said, the Image Policy and crop top rule wasn't put in place under the premise that a majority of our constituents were in favor of full tops. It was put in place to address bigger picture issues. And just like with our country's government, there are some polices/rules/laws that don't go before the general public for vote.

Again fair enough....
But again, who is it this policy is aimed at "winning" over?

Ah, being the mom of a crossover, I guess I wish it were consistent, so I don't end up with two shells every season. I"m feeling disenfranchised, (just kidding). so what is the price difference between a crop top and full top in the same?

And thanks for answering the questions here, I feel like this process has been somewhat enlightening