All-Star Your Definition Of A World's Caliber Team

[redsmom]

I can't bold, underline, enlarge this statement enough.

I feel very strongly about teams competing towards the end of the season and "defaulting" into an at-large bid. I don't care how hard the team has worked the last 3 weeks to get the routine together and they're newly formed, or whatever the circumstance may be- as it has been mentioned before, Worlds is THE BEST OF THE BEST. I firmly think there should be a minimum score needed to be reached, or you must placed top 3 or something. I'm nervous about it turning into just another national competition where anybody can go. It's prestigious for a reason. It's not about "going for experience". You go because you are the best of the best, not to hang out in Disney with other cheerleaders and your friends.

I pretty much agree with this as well. My point is that the problem is the bid system, not the teams that are rightfully using bids received under the current system. Fix the bid system, don't blame the gyms/teams that take advantage of the current system.

 

[Flyer mom]

Bids should be earned period. Yes it is the system that is the issue. A team that finished 11th out of 12 teams in their division and in the bottom 10 percent of the whole level 5 division should not recieve a bid. There are way to many gyms who throw together what they call a level 5 team together at the end of the year, and say we got a worlds bid. Some of these teams cant beat level 4 teams at competitions they go to. So is it the system, or is it the owner of the gym, knowing the type of quality team he is putting on the floor to say they went to worlds for their benefit, not the parents or kids.

 

[Cheer_Explosion_Coach]

We should all be asking the USASF why they would start at "Worlds" competitions, without having fully thought out a legitimate bid process. I'm still confused as to why are teams competing at a bid giving competition has to compete on the EP's score sheet and not the the Worlds score sheet. Just proves that the USASF shots from the hip, and like most of us wants too much too fast. Every team who gets a bid earns it. Now whether you agree that a 10th place team should get a World's bid or not is irrelevant because those teams are clever enough to use the undeveloped rules to get there. Someone should send the original question the USASF World's committee. I'd be interested in their thoughts.

 

[cheererinIL]

Fix the bid system, don't blame the gyms/teams that take advantage of the current system.

I do agree the system is the issue here, but I do have a problem with people taking advantage of any situation. I'm naive and usually live in my own little bubble where people don't do things like this so when it happens, I'm always a little taken aback. However, we also can't blame the 12-18 year old athletes who are participating on these teams because it's also not their fault.

 

[The Sixth]

We should all be asking the USASF why they would start at "Worlds" competitions, without having fully thought out a legitimate bid process. I'm still confused as to why are teams competing at a bid giving competition has to compete on the EP's score sheet and not the the Worlds score sheet. Just proves that the USASF shots from the hip, and like most of us wants too much too fast. Every team who gets a bid earns it. Now whether you agree that a 10th place team should get a World's bid or not is irrelevant because those teams are clever enough to use the undeveloped rules to get there. Someone should send the original question the USASF World's committee. I'd be interested in their thoughts.

Firstly, I agree with where you're coming from. However I will say that All Star Cheer is still relatively new, and is constantly evolving. In time, hopefully we'll see this addressed/fixed.

Now with that said, as many have agreed here, the issue is the bid process. Let me step backwards and say, to all the people who believe if you get a bid you deserve to go, yes you do. However, not until a (high) standard is set for that bid process. Moving forward, I *personally* believe the industry as a whole is still catering to a "everybody wins" mentality. There are simply just too many divisions. On top of that, some events then recognize small gym vs large gym. Any more, and we'll be dividing divisions by hair color!

What it comes down to is money, IMO. And that's a slippery slope. I understand this IS a business, and the business is to attract as much participation as possible (make money). Without that, you don't get events with great production value, paid bids, miscellaneous cash awards, etc. And what's going to drive participation the most? The idea that you can win, get that trophy, banner, and jacket. But the flipside of that slope, is you end up with a very convoluted system that makes it harder to standardize and put competition first.

 

[redsmom]

Bids should be earned period. Yes it is the system that is the issue. A team that finished 11th out of 12 teams in their division and in the bottom 10 percent of the whole level 5 division should not recieve a bid. There are way to many gyms who throw together what they call a level 5 team together at the end of the year, and say we got a worlds bid. Some of these teams cant beat level 4 teams at competitions they go to. So is it the system, or is it the owner of the gym, knowing the type of quality team he is putting on the floor to say they went to worlds for their benefit, not the parents or kids.

I haven't personally seen gyms throwing together teams at the last minute to get a bid. Maybe that is because I haven't been to the smaller bid competitions. I've only been to JAMfest SN, NCA, Battle at the Capitol and Cheersport Naionals. The teams I am "defending" are those that have been level 5 all year, and while they may struggle at level 5 they end up with a bid. I just don't feel it is right to spend time hating on these teams/gyms. I am curious how many of the teams you describe are out there? (I am not saying it doesn't happen I am just curious as to how often it really happens?)

 

[Mom Jeans]

Worlds is a great way for people to watch cheer in a way they've never seen it before. I don't understand why anyone cares if someone wants to go for the experience. Even on day 2, people have the opinion that non Worlds caliber teams are in Finals. You'd only like to see teams who think they can win compete? So basically if you're not in the top 5 you shouldn't be there? So the biggest comp, now becomes the smallest comp? I don't think that would help cheer grow in any way. If only the top 3 teams in our state went, no one would really care about Worlds except those top 3 teams. I wish the NBA would adopt this theory, imagine how short the season would be=)

Don't get annoyed or frustrated, skip prelims and enjoy finals. Well the last few teams in finals....

 

[Flyer mom]

I haven't personally seen gyms throwing together teams at the last minute to get a bid. Maybe that is because I haven't been to the smaller bid competitions. I've only been to JAMfest SN, NCA, Battle at the Capitol and Cheersport Naionals. The teams I am "defending" are those that have been level 5 all year, and while they may struggle at level 5 they end up with a bid. I just don't feel it is right to spend time hating on these teams/gyms. I am curious how many of the teams you describe are out there? (I am not saying it doesn't happen I am just curious as to how often it really happens?)

I am talking about the competitions at the end of year. I am not going to name any names of teams, because it is unfair to the kids. Look at GLCC this last weekend which started this debate and the teams that got at large bids. What alot of teams do is wait for the high school season to be over and take kids from high school teams and try and put together a worlds team. Then they will say well we have only been together for 4 weeks and got choreography 3 weeks ago and we got a bid. Well great you came in last, and still got a bid. I am not hating on the kids. The kids deserve no blame at all in this situation, it is the rules and the gym owners who deserve the blame.

 

[The Sixth]

Worlds is a great way for people to watch cheer in a way they've never seen it before. I don't understand why anyone cares if someone wants to go for the experience.

I've already stated scheduling. Keep in mind this is the pinnacle of cheer. How would you like to have to be up at 5:30am for warm-ups, be expected to sit around all day, and be prepared to give your very best again 12 hours later? 3 hours...4 hours...maybe...but over half a day? And I didn't even mention the fallout from the A/B group prelim scoring. Cut down on the number of teams that attend, and it alleviates both of those situations.

If ppl want to experience Worlds for the fun of it, just go as a spectator. I think you can still get about 90% of the experience without competing.

 

[redsmom]

I am talking about the competitions at the end of year. I am not going to name any names of teams, because it is unfair to the kids. Look at GLCC this last weekend which started this debate and the teams that got at large bids. What alot of teams do is wait for the high school season to be over and take kids from high school teams and try and put together a worlds team. Then they will say well we have only been together for 4 weeks and got choreography 3 weeks ago and we got a bid. Well great you came in last, and still got a bid. I am not hating on the kids. The kids deserve no blame at all in this situation, it is the rules and the gym owners who deserve the blame.

Absolutely don't want you to call out any gyms, I am guessing that out of the 200+ teams that have bids probably only a few (less then 10) fall into this category. Not sure its worth worrying about, while they have gained some bragging rights, the experience of getting up early at worlds on Saturday morning only to be soundly beat by 30 to 40 solid teams with At Large bids will probably not be so great. Hopefully they will still have a fun weekend and enjoy the experience of Worlds, the same as the rest of us spectators!

 

[PullandPray23]

I like level 5/6 teams doing variations of 5/6 skills with innovation (and decent music although this isn't that important)

 

[cupieqt]

I've already stated scheduling. Keep in mind this is the pinnacle of cheer. How would you like to have to be up at 5:30am for warm-ups, be expected to sit around all day, and be prepared to give your very best again 12 hours later? 3 hours...4 hours...maybe...but over half a day? And I didn't even mention the fallout from the A/B group prelim scoring. Cut down on the number of teams that attend, and it alleviates both of those situations.

If ppl want to experience Worlds for the fun of it, just go as a spectator. I think you can still get about 90% of the experience without competing.

Shimmy shimmy shimmy shimmy! Sorry. 1 wasn't enough...
I was attacked for implying teams didn't "deserve" to go so I backed off. But I can't get my head around throwing teams together and coming in last and getting bids. Im just starting to get the feeling that if I found a golden ticket on the ground amongst the cheer trash after a comp I could go to Worlds and compete with my Sr 3.

 

[ilikebigbows]

If you can throw and hit consistant level 5/6 skills. Your routine may not have eight tick tocks and squad standing fulls, but if you do well on the difficulty grid and can hit it consistently, then right on, bro. People are saying Worlds is for the "elite", but who gets the say on what the definition of "elite" is? Who decides which team is considered "elite" and who is not? It's opinion. I like how the system works now. You never know...that team who "didn't deserve the bid" may pull something sick out of their butt for Worlds and surprise you all. (;

 

[CrownedtheGR8est]

Here's how I see it, worlds is a huge learning experience. Even if you don't have a chance of cracking into top 10. The same athletes next year will be so much more confident and it will show in both their performance and leadership abilities.

 

[The Sixth]

If you can throw and hit consistant level 5/6 skills........

You're contradicting yourself. The scoring grid *should* define what is elite and what is not. So it's NOT opinion. The problem right now, is it's based on several different ones. The expectation is that the USASF, and the voting membership decides how to standardize the process, or "definition of elite". Which really comes down to two things, a universal scoring sheet, and a cutoff score. So maybe there is a TAD bit of opinion with the latter. But are we really going to argue if scoring 80 on a scale of 100 is considered elite?