OT Inappropriate Discussions With Athletes

[oncecoolcoachnowmom]

Thanks for this. I've avoided this thread for self-preservation because my opinion wouldn't be popular. But, you know me...I'm not likely to keep it to myself forever.

There is such a thing as a kid to big to fly.

It doesn't mean they're overweight or unhealthy. Mine is built like me. I don't think either of us are overweight (yeah I could lose 15) but it still wouldn't make me a feasible flyer. I'm 5-9 and 160. She's built like me. I knew she'd come out of the air eventually when I recognized she could only fly on an older age group. Sooner or later there is no older age group.

So, while I don't understand the context of the coaches comment to weigh in here specifically, my reflection is that coaches are generally in a lose lose situation.

Either they have a conversation in some manner about why a flyer may not continue to fly (and get the "you're calling my kid fat/building bad body image/how dare you") reaction, or they stay silent and eventually take the flyer down and get the "I don't understand why you won't let her fly anymore" reaction.

When a flyer comes down because of their size (and that is legitimate and happens) a coach basically has to decide if they're going to be in insensitive a$$hole or the aloof, non-communicative evader. I think that's a bad position for all parties involved.

YES.

I coach a J3. That's a big "growth spurt" age range.

Some of those kids flew on their Youth teams.

Then they hit puberty and are now a foot taller than everyone else and totally solid muscle.

Are they fat? No. But no one stays Youth flyer sized forever.

When you are a foot taller than everyone else and now 20 lbs heavier as well (not saying you are fat by any means but you are not the itty bitty that you once were when you were on youth, because you were a little kid and now you're a tween) I. need. you. as. a backspot. or base. I NEED IT.

Another angle to this that people fail to understand is that if Girl Who is Now Bigger Than Everyone Else is still in the air, WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO WITH THE 4'9 AND 80 lb GIRL IN HER GROUP?

She hasn't got a prayer in the world of basing her and I'm not making her a nugget.

 

[AllstarObsession]

I also struggle with an ed, and I have been lucky enough to have sensitive coaches. I am even comfortable enough now to bring it up to my new coaches, just so they're aware. I'm also comfortable speaking about it with others, especially if it raises awareness and stops comments like these.

I think a big problem with comments like this is that the offender is probably unaware of the effect it has on a disordered mind. It doesn't matter if it was a joke. If anyone comments on my weight, it stays with me for weeks and will often trigger some disordered behaviors, which at this point, put a lot of stress on my heart and digestive system. I can't really afford a full blown relapse at this point, and I would hate for a coach to cause a recurrence of a potentially fatal disorder. My point is, it doesn't matter if someone is "joking" or not, because you never know who is struggling.

 

[mollymags]

I usually just tell kids that I need them as a base more than I need them as a top girl, it doesn't mean they aren't talented, it's just that I need their talent to be used elsewhere. However, if I'm not approached about the situation, I usually won't open up the conversation (unless I have to pull a kid out of the air midseason) but once a new season starts, all spots are fair game.


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This is exactly how I've always handled taking kids out of the air due to size. I tell them "you are doing a great job as a flyer but you are also soooo strong and I really need a good strong base like you. I know you love flying but remember it's really special that you are able to be a good flyer AND base, not everyone can do that."

 

[quitthedrama]

But no one stays Youth flyer sized forever.

Actually...

 

[Fierce_Elite]

I think she went about it the wrong way. I don't think she meant hurt you. If she truly thought that your weight was affecting the team, she could have talked to you about that in private with your parents

 

[Fierce_Elite]

She would have been better off not saying anything period.

 

[cheer25mom]

This is exactly how I've always handled taking kids out of the air due to size. I tell them "you are doing a great job as a flyer but you are also soooo strong and I really need a good strong base like you. I know you love flying but remember it's really special that you are able to be a good flyer AND base, not everyone can do that."

I don't get why we as adults aren't willing to tell kids the truth. We don't have to be ugly about it, but my 11 year old would definitely see through this kind of speech, and know the coach was dancing around the issue. It would cause more head games with her about her weight than coming out and saying " you hit a growth spurt and are too big to fly on this team. That doesn't make you fat or mean you will never fly again, but it's not going to work this season"

 

[retiredl5cheer]

I don't get why we as adults aren't willing to tell kids the truth. We don't have to be ugly about it, but my 11 year old would definitely see through this kind of speech, and know the coach was dancing around the issue. It would cause more head games with her about her weight than coming out and saying " you hit a growth spurt and are too big to fly on this team. That doesn't make you fat or mean you will never fly again, but it's not going to work this season"

What's good for one child is bad for another. The level of honesty I use truly depends on the kid, but it's always safest to accentuate the positive instead of the negative. I find that most kids are really bummed when they're grounded, so framing it as something positive can help them move on. Plus, I like to hype up the importance of basing every day anyways.

 

[cheer25mom]

What's good for one child is bad for another. The level of honesty I use truly depends on the kid, but it's always safest to accentuate the positive instead of the negative. I find that most kids are really bummed when they're grounded, so framing it as something positive can help them move on. Plus, I like to hype up the importance of basing every day anyways.

Does it really fool the kids though? Do they really but into it? I can't see it working with anyone over about 8. I get trying to be positive and yes they will be bummed about being grounded, but I don't see kids being happy about being blatantly lied to and I would think that would cause more problems than it would solve. Like, " why isn't she telling me what I know is true? Does she think I'm fat, but not want to tell me? Does she really think I don't KNOW I'm bigger than all the other flyers?" I would think the thoughts lying to them produces would be more harmful than just telling them in a caring way.


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[retiredl5cheer]

Does it really fool the kids though? Do they really but into it? I can't see it working with anyone over about 8. I get trying to be positive and yes they will be bummed about being grounded, but I don't see kids being happy about being blatantly lied to and I would think that would cause more problems than it would solve. Like, " why isn't she telling me what I know is true? Does she think I'm fat, but not want to tell me? Does she really think I don't KNOW I'm bigger than all the other flyers?" I would think the thoughts lying to them produces would be more harmful than just telling them in a caring way.


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Who said I was lying?

Here's the thing, no matter how I say "sorry honey, you're too big," it's still going to be a negative thing. I can say it lovingly, wrap it with a hug, and throw unicorns and glitter on it...it's still incredibly negative. I don't care if they're thinking it in their head, as soon as I say it out loud, it's real and it's awful. In my personal experience, when I frame it as something positive and make a child feel like they're a very valuable part of the team, I have better results getting good effort from that child after the switch. Many children will completely shut down if you tell them they're too big. It's just like telling them they're not good enough.

 

[cheer25mom]

Who said I was lying?

Here's the thing, no matter how I say "sorry honey, you're too big," it's still going to be a negative thing. I can say it lovingly, wrap it with a hug, and throw unicorns and glitter on it...it's still incredibly negative. I don't care if they're thinking it in their head, as soon as I say it out loud, it's real and it's awful. In my personal experience, when I frame it as something positive and make a child feel like they're a very valuable part of the team, I have better results getting good effort from that child after the switch. Many children will completely shut down if you tell them they're too big. It's just like telling them they're not good enough.

If the real reason you took a girl out of the air is her size and you feel her it's not, I see that as lying.
Why is it awful? It shouldn't be. I don't even think it's really negative, if they have been taught the right attitude about positions on a team all along and taught that everyone is equal. If flying is put up on some pedestal then yes, it is going to be negative, but that shouldn't be the case. Growing and maturing should never be seen as negative, and I see telling less than the truth about it as making it negative. It's ok to be too big to fly. There is NOTHING wrong with that, and I think dancing around the true reason sends the message that it us something to be ashamed of. To each his own, but I think it's always better to be open and honest with kids. They always know when you aren't.



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[SarahS]

Does it really fool the kids though? Do they really but into it? I can't see it working with anyone over about 8. I get trying to be positive and yes they will be bummed about being grounded, but I don't see kids being happy about being blatantly lied to and I would think that would cause more problems than it would solve. Like, " why isn't she telling me what I know is true? Does she think I'm fat, but not want to tell me? Does she really think I don't KNOW I'm bigger than all the other flyers?" I would think the thoughts lying to them produces would be more harmful than just telling them in a caring way.


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It isn't lying. The child really IS needed as a base. The kid working out in that position really IS valuable. Coaches really DO want the kids to succeed and help the team in their new positions. It really isn't about that particular kid's size - it is ALWAYS about what works best for the team. I never take a kid out of the air because she is too big. I change positions to best fit the team. It isn't ever about one child.

 

[mollymags]

Does it really fool the kids though? Do they really but into it? I can't see it working with anyone over about 8. I get trying to be positive and yes they will be bummed about being grounded, but I don't see kids being happy about being blatantly lied to and I would think that would cause more problems than it would solve. Like, " why isn't she telling me what I know is true? Does she think I'm fat, but not want to tell me? Does she really think I don't KNOW I'm bigger than all the other flyers?" I would think the thoughts lying to them produces would be more harmful than just telling them in a caring way.


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I personally would never feel comfortable making a comment about a child's size. I work with youth kids, and I know that they understand that they're bigger than other flyers and some of them are really sensitive about it. On the other hand, a good handful of the kids beg to fly, regardless of if they're 2 heads taller than all the other flyers, so I think the size issue doesn't always register with all the kids.

I feel like commenting directly on it could be a little too much for some of them, no matter how gracefully it's worded. I personally struggled with a lot of body image and self esteem issues growing up and I know having a coach say something like that to me would have felt like a huge slap in the face. You can never be sure what kids can really handle hearing something like that because those issues can be deep rooted and well hidden. At an age where some of them are about to or are just starting to hit puberty, I get too nervous to feed into any existing or potential complexes.

I haven't coached teenagers, but I'm sure they need a different approach. But for my 11&under crowd, I prefer to make the conversation about building skills and not about their body.

 

[mollymags]

Does it really fool the kids though? Do they really but into it? I can't see it working with anyone over about 8. I get trying to be positive and yes they will be bummed about being grounded, but I don't see kids being happy about being blatantly lied to and I would think that would cause more problems than it would solve. Like, " why isn't she telling me what I know is true? Does she think I'm fat, but not want to tell me? Does she really think I don't KNOW I'm bigger than all the other flyers?" I would think the thoughts lying to them produces would be more harmful than just telling them in a caring way.


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Also... Would YOU feel comfortable telling someone else's kid that they're too big to fly?

 

[retiredl5cheer]

If the real reason you took a girl out of the air is her size and you feel her it's not, I see that as lying.
Why is it awful? It shouldn't be. I don't even think it's really negative, if they have been taught the right attitude about positions on a team all along and taught that everyone is equal. If flying is put up on some pedestal then yes, it is going to be negative, but that shouldn't be the case. Growing and maturing should never be seen as negative, and I see telling less than the truth about it as making it negative. It's ok to be too big to fly. There is NOTHING wrong with that, and I think dancing around the true reason sends the message that it us something to be ashamed of. To each his own, but I think it's always better to be open and honest with kids. They always know when you aren't.

I'm a no-nonsense person like you, @cheer25mom, so I do understand where you're coming from. I think you're absolutely correct in understanding that YOUR child wouldn't appreciate the size issue being danced around. Unfortunately, I don't have the luxury of having a mother-daughter relationship with the kids I coach, so it's not appropriate for me to make that call.

ETA: The reason I think it's negative is because it's not constructive. There's nothing a child can do to change their size, so why even bother talking about it? I emphasize my need for a strong base because it's something the child can take control of. She can run with that encouragement and make herself the best darn base on the team.