All-Star Crossovers And Sandbagging

[klynn64]

Are you sure about this, have you not seen some of the teams competing for world bids right now?

@CEA_ATC and others please remember we are not attacking the athletes just the circumstances and scenarios of crossovers.

My cp crosses over but with only 3-4 crossovers I don't see that as sandbagging but if .Half a team is crossing down that yes I am much more likely to call it sandbagging. There are many with the opinion that even one or two kids crossing down is sandbagging and that is okay but then again since my CP crosses down I definitely will have a different perspective than those on teams who do not have crossovers.


**Show of hands, who thinks their vague booking about changing gyms is so clever we don't understand it?**

That's exactly my point. Those teams competing for those bids are NOT populated with Level 3 athletes. Rather the Level 3 team is populated with Level 5 athletes. They can wordsmith it all they want. But it's obvious what is taking place.

I'd like to know, how many Worlds athletes at this particular gym also compete at Summit ?

 

[2 girls that cheer]

That's exactly my point. Those teams competing for those bids are NOT populated with Level 3 athletes. Rather the Level 3 team is populated with Level 5 athletes. They can wordsmith it all they want. But it's obvious what is taking place.

I'd like to know, how many Worlds athletes at this particular gym also compete at Summit ?

I agree!! We may never know!!

 

[klynn64]

Just curious for those in the know. Have crossovers always been used in Cheerleading ? I only have ten years involved in cheer so I don't know the history prior to the that. Have crossovers always been utilized to accommodate attrition, injury, and illness primarily or is it the norm for a gym to utilize the allowance of crossovers as a training tool ?

I may be wrong but it seems that over the past couple of years the use (or should I say abuse) of crossovers has greatly increased. Does it seem like that is the case ?

 

[MissCongeniality]

Just curious for those in the know. Have crossovers always been used in Cheerleading ? I only have ten years involved in cheer so I don't know the history prior to the that. Have crossovers always been utilized to accommodate attrition, injury, and illness primarily or is it the norm for a gym to utilize the allowance of crossovers as a training tool ?

I may be wrong but it seems that over the past couple of years the use (or should I say abuse) of crossovers has greatly increased. Does it seem like that is the case ?

My CP was a crossover from the beginning at a very small program. It was her choice and they needed her on both teams. She was again a crossover later on...her first-year of world's eligibility when she made the transition from flying to base (to ensure she had a team if she was not able to rise to the level of level 5 base). Finally, she has crossed mid season to fill in for injuries when needed.
That said... One thing I've noticed...EPs charge much more for crossovers these days. Do I think that it's coincidence? Nope! Crossovers are an additional gravy train for this industry.

 

[omgitssydthekid]

Just curious for those in the know. Have crossovers always been used in Cheerleading ? I only have ten years involved in cheer so I don't know the history prior to the that. Have crossovers always been utilized to accommodate attrition, injury, and illness primarily or is it the norm for a gym to utilize the allowance of crossovers as a training tool ?

I may be wrong but it seems that over the past couple of years the use (or should I say abuse) of crossovers has greatly increased. Does it seem like that is the case ?

I can only speak from personal experience, but the first gym I was at used crossovers heavily. There was one season that their entire "senior open" level 5 team literally crossed over to other teams within the gym. I was told that you could only be on that team if you were also crossing over to another team.

That was probably four years ago. Now, the gym I coach at tries to limit crossovers as much as possible. Last May when teams were formed, we had one planned crossover. At the competition we competed at this past weekend we had a total of eighteen kids crossing over due to sickness, injury, athletes quitting, or being in violation of the handbook. We don't usually have that many at one time, but there were some unusual circumstances that happened before this competition. Most of our crossovers are not permanent, they just fill in for a competition or two.

I see excessive crossovers a lot in this area, and it's usually from the same larger gyms. There is a large gym in the area I live in that has a girl on their mini level 1 that is a level 5 tumbler and she flies on their junior level 4 team. They have several level 5 tumblers on that team as we have seen their minis warm up fulls at competition earlier this season and it just does not sit right with me.


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[ChoreographyInTheBack]

The gym I cheered at used crossovers heavily. I crossed over to senior 3 once and it was a wreck. The girls were incredibly mean to me because my team was more successful & got more attention. I had been on that team the year before & I think they were very bitter that I had gotten moved up (even though I had all the skills, despite breaking my neck & trying out before I was even released). This goes to show that crossing over isn't always enjoyable. I was bullied & tweeted about to the point where I ended up going to my favorite coach and quitting.

My normal team was very strict about tumbling. You needed to have every single skill or your spot was gone. The level 3 team was more relaxed and had several girls who didn't have level 3 skills. The stunts were struggling and they ended up pulling several girls off my team and from schools in the area to make things hit. It was a real crap show. And they never taught the new girls the dance so there was a 12 count of chicken nuggets in the back for over half the season, so that was awkward.

 

[klynn64]

My CP was a crossover from the beginning at a very small program. It was her choice and they needed her on both teams. She was again a crossover later on...her first-year of world's eligibility when she made the transition from flying to base (to ensure she had a team if she was not able to rise to the level of level 5 base). Finally, she has crossed mid season to fill in for injuries when needed.
That said... One thing I've noticed...EPs charge much more for crossovers these days. Do I think that it's coincidence? Nope! Crossovers are an additional gravy train for this industry.

Recently I saw a comp. where crossovers were free. They know how to entice gyms to attend. Next year that comp. will be the largest in the entire industry.:banghead:

 

[klynn64]

The gym I cheered at used crossovers heavily. I crossed over to senior 3 once and it was a wreck. The girls were incredibly mean to me because my team was more successful & got more attention. I had been on that team the year before & I think they were very bitter that I had gotten moved up (even though I had all the skills, despite breaking my neck & trying out before I was even released). This goes to show that crossing over isn't always enjoyable. I was bullied & tweeted about to the point where I ended up going to my favorite coach and quitting.

My normal team was very strict about tumbling. You needed to have every single skill or your spot was gone. The level 3 team was more relaxed and had several girls who didn't have level 3 skills. The stunts were struggling and they ended up pulling several girls off my team and from schools in the area to make things hit. It was a real crap show. And they never taught the new girls the dance so there was a 12 count of chicken nuggets in the back for over half the season, so that was awkward.

Too bad they didn't deal with the bullies. You shouldn't have had to quit. There's so much bullying that goes on amongst team members on some of the teams. Often times I don't even think the coaches are aware it goes on. They need to be so they can put the bullies on check and stop the nonsense. Such a competititive environment and mad jealousy brings out the worst in people.

 

[klynn64]

I can only speak from personal experience, but the first gym I was at used crossovers heavily. There was one season that their entire "senior open" level 5 team literally crossed over to other teams within the gym. I was told that you could only be on that team if you were also crossing over to another team.

That was probably four years ago. Now, the gym I coach at tries to limit crossovers as much as possible. Last May when teams were formed, we had one planned crossover. At the competition we competed at this past weekend we had a total of eighteen kids crossing over due to sickness, injury, athletes quitting, or being in violation of the handbook. We don't usually have that many at one time, but there were some unusual circumstances that happened before this competition. Most of our crossovers are not permanent, they just fill in for a competition or two.

I see excessive crossovers a lot in this area, and it's usually from the same larger gyms. There is a large gym in the area I live in that has a girl on their mini level 1 that is a level 5 tumbler and she flies on their junior level 4 team. They have several level 5 tumblers on that team as we have seen their minis warm up fulls at competition earlier this season and it just does not sit right with me.


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Wow!

 

[MissCongeniality]

Recently I saw a comp. where crossovers were free. They know how to entice gyms to attend. Next year that comp. will be the largest in the entire industry.:banghead:

Lol!

 

[quitthedrama]

Just curious for those in the know. Have crossovers always been used in Cheerleading ? I only have ten years involved in cheer so I don't know the history prior to the that. Have crossovers always been utilized to accommodate attrition, injury, and illness primarily or is it the norm for a gym to utilize the allowance of crossovers as a training tool ?

I may be wrong but it seems that over the past couple of years the use (or should I say abuse) of crossovers has greatly increased. Does it seem like that is the case ?

Crossovers have been used for as long as my CP has been involved (so for the last 8-9 years at least). I think it maybe hasn't increased significantly, but with social media and videos being so easily accessible and twitter bios saying "I'm on this team and this team and this team" it has become much easier to recognize.

 

[Ashley]

Crossovers have been used for as long as my CP has been involved (so for the last 8-9 years at least). I think it maybe hasn't increased significantly, but with social media and videos being so easily accessible and twitter bios saying "I'm on this team and this team and this team" it has become much easier to recognize.

I think this is my 8th year on an open 6 team (oh jeezzzzz) and we had crossovers from our senior team my first year. And crossovers pretty much every other year. I think this is the first year we don't have any. At one of my old gyms I did coed 6 and all-girl 6.

And one year we competed against a team that had an i5 and an i6. Except I'm pretty sure most of the team was on both. What's the point?!

Of course, crossovers to open teams aren't really the same and no one cares about those lol.

 

[311cheermom]

Until USASF changes the rules, in black and white, this debate is all moot. Because Team A has level 5/3 crossdowns, Team B has to do it to stay competitive at level 3, then Team C finally gives in after a couple years and starts doing it...

Gym owners and coaches are going to have to maximize their team's advantage to keep them competitive as long as it is still legal. Otherwise, they will lose their kids to the "winning" gyms who have no problems crossing kids over levels.

I haven't been at this for long, but I've seen more and more gyms doing it since we started just a few years ago.

 

[MaineStar234]

At the small gym in Maine I cheered at, we didn't use crossovers until I was in like 8th grade (so 6 years ago). And it was only like three girls who crossovered total for the 8 teams we had then, and it was only if there was an injury or someone quit. The next year more kids crossed over, myself included. I was a crossover from senior 4 to senior 3, then senior 4 to 4.2, then senior 4 to 3, and my final year senior R5 to 3. There was probably about 8 other girls who crossed the same teams as myself, but most teams had like at least 10 crossovers. The year before the number of teams was limited there was one girl who did 4 teams (she also cheered for her middle school and took 8 dance classes and got straight A's, she had no free time at all, her mom wanted her to do everything and was fairly stage mom/Susie's mom type but that's for another thread). Anyway, currently they still use a lot of crossovers, there's probably like 8 or so kids in the gym of about 50 athletes who cross 3 teams. Back when I cheered I didn't have a negative opinion on crossovers, probably because we relied on them my last few years, but through reading threads on here and such my opinion changed fairly quickly after graduating.


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[Fiercecheermom]

After rereading The Summit rules, I have learned
1) Athletes can "cross to 2 additional teams" ....so they can compete 3 times?
2) Only 5 Worlds athletes can cross over to each Summit team (team NOT gym)
3) No crossovers between dance and cheer.
4) 10 point deduction for each illegal participant for a maximum of a 20 point deduction.
So, it's okay to compete on 3 teams and an unlimited amount of Worlds athletes could be spread among the teams of a gym. Additionally, I wonder if the 20 point deduction might not be enough to deter some gyms from taking the gamble LOL...