All-Star Design the perfect scoring system

[Evergreen]

I would not like to see "cheer" left off the score sheets. Motions are a part of cheerleading and the judges should have a place to score them. If a team doesn't have good motions then they are not well rounded just as much as if they didnt have good tumbling/stunting/jumps/dancing.

The problem is that all star teams no longer hit any cheer motions. They hit a high V in a stunt and maybe before a jump (but really not even then, because most teams do the clasp before their jumps). The motions in dance aren't traditional cheer motions, so it's difficult to really see the placement of the motions, when we judge we're really looking more at their sharpness.

 

[King]

The problem is that all star teams no longer hit any cheer motions. They hit a high V in a stunt and maybe before a jump (but really not even then, because most teams do the clasp before their jumps). The motions in dance aren't traditional cheer motions, so it's difficult to really see the placement of the motions, when we judge we're really looking more at their sharpness.

i think i combined transitions and motions. it would be in the same range of the level (level 5 would be in the 8's kinda thing). you would have a range of 1 point to reward transitions and motions. enough that you have to care about the whole category, not enough that one team wins solely because of motions.

 

[King]

i think i combined transitions and motions. it would be in the same range of the level (level 5 would be in the 8's kinda thing). you would have a range of 1 point to reward transitions and motions. enough that you have to care about the whole category, not enough that one team wins solely because of motions.

Ok, I think I have figured out a good balance. Please feel free to criticize. The percentages I have chosen can be adjusted (per competition if needed) but what is great is the judges themselves would use the same mechanics overtime for every category on every scoresheet. Training to actually use the scoresheet wouldn't have to change per competition.

Tumbling - 37.5%
Standing
Running
Jumps
Synch

Building - 37.5%
Baskets
Pyramid
Elite Stunt - At 50% of your team must participate in this (playing with this idea)
Team Stunt - Entire squad participate in this

Cheer - 25%
Dance
Choreography - this is transitions, formations, motions, a lil overall impression. the most skilled team at a competition that has terrible choreography will see a hit here, but it wont prevent someone from winning.

All deductions are taken off in that category only. If someone messes up a basket, it is not taken off in final score, but in JUST that skill category. This makes mistakes worth a little less and difficulty worth more. Execution will still matter a lot.

 

[Num1Stunta]

Ok, I think I have figured out a good balance. Please feel free to criticize. The percentages I have chosen can be adjusted (per competition if needed) but what is great is the judges themselves would use the same mechanics overtime for every category on every scoresheet. Training to actually use the scoresheet wouldn't have to change per competition.

Tumbling - 37.5%
Standing
Running
Jumps
Synch

Building - 37.5%
Baskets
Pyramid
Elite Stunt - At 50% of your team must participate in this (playing with this idea)
Team Stunt - Entire squad participate in this

Cheer - 25%
Dance
Choreography - this is transitions, formations, motions, a lil overall impression. the most skilled team at a competition that has terrible choreography will see a hit here, but it wont prevent someone from winning.

All deductions are taken off in that category only. If someone messes up a basket, it is not taken off in final score, but in JUST that skill category. This makes mistakes worth a little less and difficulty worth more. Execution will still matter a lot.

That is GREAT, I love that there's a section for team stunt... so, when are you implementing this new scoresheet? lol

 

[King]

That is GREAT, I love that there's a section for team stunt... so, when are you implementing this new scoresheet? lol

There is going to be a universal scoresheet. Why not design it and let the the community agree on it, then submit it. We are less burdened by politics, so we can make one that actually works.

 

[Evergreen]

I love the idea of a universal score sheet! Some companies have a different score sheet depending on what Level team you are. So L1-3 is out of 85 points, L4-6 are out of 100 pts, rec/school have completeley different scoring. It makes sense for school to have different scoring, but not rec-since most rec teams are wannabe all stars and structure their routines off of an all star model. I hate when I judge L2 and 5...I have to switch my "out of" number when I switch levels.

 

[ohkcheery]

How are deductions going to work?
Will it be for falls and bobbles and the like? Or do we also add in something like Cheersport with deductions for missed skills?

 

[King]

I love the idea of a universal score sheet! Some companies have a different score sheet depending on what Level team you are. So L1-3 is out of 85 points, L4-6 are out of 100 pts, rec/school have completeley different scoring. It makes sense for school to have different scoring, but not rec-since most rec teams are wannabe all stars and structure their routines off of an all star model. I hate when I judge L2 and 5...I have to switch my "out of" number when I switch levels.

Thats the design. I am already working on color coded scoresheets for this to work. Basically you always use the same methodology to score each level, but the ranges are always the same.

As well to make sure everyone is in the correct category there is one mandatory skill in each skill category to make sure everyone is in the right range.

These skills would be like: double down in stunts in level 5. jump connected handspring in level 3.

 

[King]

How are deductions going to work?
Will it be for falls and bobbles and the like? Or do we also add in something like Cheersport with deductions for missed skills?

I dont think you should have a deduction for a 'missed' skill. that is toooo subjective. the only way that could work is if it was written down before the routine went that 'this' is the skill i should be performing.

 

[King]

Compulsory skills to put you in the correct level range (there is no requirement for level 1 since that is the starting level). Help adjust if needed

Level 2
Stunting - One leg stunt at chin level
basket - straight ride
pyramid - extended one leg
standing - standing HS
running - RO HS
jumps - 2 connected jumps

Level 3
Stunting - Full down
basket - one trick basket
pyramid - one release move
standing - standing multiple HS
running - RO HS Tuck
jumps - Jump handspring connection

Level 4
Stunting - two legged double down
basket - two trick basket
pyramid - braced flip
standing - standing tuck
running - layout
jumps - Jump handspring tuck


Level 5
Stunting - Extended one leg double down
basket - kick double basket
pyramid - one arm braced flip
standing - something that ends in a twist
running - something that ends with a twist
jumps - connected jump flip combo

 

[ohkcheery]

I dont think you should have a deduction for a 'missed' skill. that is toooo subjective. the only way that could work is if it was written down before the routine went that 'this' is the skill i should be performing.

Potentially if could be confusing in lower levels, but if you're in Level 5 running tumbling and you end with a RO instead of a full, clearly you omitted your skill. If you do one twist down instead of doubling down, same thing. Or even if you only go to a lib while everyone else is in scorps.. do you just ignore the deductions? Lower their max skill points instead? Lower the overall impression score?

 

[King]

overall impression is the worst thing in cheerleading. you can take a routine that scores well and kill it JUST because you want to. so lets say a judge has bias and hates backwoods allstars, they can reflect that in one category.

i believe execution and difficulty would be affected by a 'missed' skill anyway. if your last pass doesnt double in level 5 would you keep the difficulty or execution score as high?

 

[rvnblue]

what if a team decides to do all toe touch double baskets? and then variations?

 

[King]

what if a team decides to do all toe touch double baskets? and then variations?

I am sure the wording can be somehow included that any harder skill that is a natural progression of the required skill will suffice the requirement.

the idea is that everyone knows the minimum stuff needed to get into the right category to get scored. This way a level 3 team doesn't do JUST toe touches (without handsprings) and expect a level 3 jump score.

 

[King]

I am sure the wording can be somehow included that any harder skill that is a natural progression of the required skill will suffice the requirement.

the idea is that everyone knows the minimum stuff needed to get into the right category to get scored. This way a level 3 team doesn't do JUST toe touches (without handsprings) and expect a level 3 jump score.

If the required skill is not thrown, but a more advanced skill that follows the same legality rule of the mandatory skill then the mandatory skill requirement will have been met. Example: a switch kick double is following the same legalities as a kick double, therefor is a suitable replacement.