All-Star Worlds Finals 2012 Changes...

[kristenthegreat]

How many foreign teams attend worlds each year? and how many actually place top 3?

i still think the foreign teams would go to worlds regardless of what place they got. ive seen a lot of teams come each year and not even make finals. i think the babying of foreign teams need to stop. i think a lot of foreign teams would step up their game if they knew they had to go against everyone to make finals.

I think we had a side-discussion about this around Worlds with the whole Bangkok fiasco, but I don't think it's 'babying.' Sure, it sucks for international 'American' teams, but don't you think they'd (the international teams) whip out those magical doubles if they could? It's kinda like on the score sheet when someone writes 'add more doubles'..well of course you'd LIKE to, but you can't. That being said I think they're catching up admirably for how much we demand of them (considering in many cases they're a good couple of years or so 'behind' us, in terms of many things). Maybe it will be only a few more years before we don't really need to keep doing the '3 teams from each country' thing..and we'll have a REAL worlds in other countries. I know I know, wishful thinking we'll be moving it around from the House of Mouse.

 

[MissCongeniality]

I think in a sport where injuries can and do happen as frequently as in cheer... it is not fair to give any team a "free pass" to finals or even a later round based on the type of bid they won. Every team should compete the same number of times to earn the right to call themselves the World champion.

As far as a division with only 3 (or a definite small amount) teams... maybe there could be some sort of process whereby it is either the top 50% that moves on to round 2 or "in divisions with less than X teams, a minimum score of XXX must be obtained to progress to the next level" Don't set the bar so low that the smaller division teams can just mark their routines... they have to go out and hit at a level that you'd expect the top 50% in any division to hit to make round 2. Then same thing for finals...adjusting the score for what a typical team would be expected to score to make the final round.

I just don't think it is fair that one team needs to prove themselves any more than any other team based upon bid type of number of competitors in a division. Everyone needs to go out and prove they deserve their placement.

 

[chyeeaaa69]

I understand, the "babying" of foreign teams isn't something any American cheerleader appreciates. You have all worked just as hard to get there, and yet just because team A is from a country where only 3 teams are going, they go to finals, however I think it needs to continue for a little while. The changing of the international scoresheet is doing NOTHING to push teams to further tumbling, so why not change something like that(I know it's been changed now for the next 3 years) before changing who goes to finals? See if it has the desired effect for 1-2 seasons, maybe 3, THEN tell the other countries that their spots are no longer "guaranteed". Like I said earlier, the international teams are stepping it up. I know the 3 IOAG 5 teams from Canada outscored teams from America (one of them even placing top 3 after day 1), and a team from Canada won IOAG 6, and Bangkok obviously is a good example, but I still think it needs a few more years before basically getting thrown to the sharks(no pun intended), if that's the expression I'm looking for?
Also, and maybe this is wishful thinking, but maybe if USASF takes finals down to 10 per division, they will also start to see less need for 345938745 bids going out during the year, as they're wasting their time with a vast majority of them, however as I said, this is wishful thinking, they wouldn't make NEAR the amount of money if only, let's say, 15 teams in small senior went to Worlds.

 

[BlueCat]

I understand, the "babying" of foreign teams isn't something any American cheerleader appreciates. You have all worked just as hard to get there, and yet just because team A is from a country where only 3 teams are going, they go to finals, however I think it needs to continue for a little while. The changing of the international scoresheet is doing NOTHING to push teams to further tumbling, so why not change something like that(I know it's been changed now for the next 3 years) before changing who goes to finals? See if it has the desired effect for 1-2 seasons, maybe 3, THEN tell the other countries that their spots are no longer "guaranteed". Like I said earlier, the international teams are stepping it up. I know the 3 IOAG 5 teams from Canada outscored teams from America (one of them even placing top 3 after day 1), and a team from Canada won IOAG 6, and Bangkok obviously is a good example, but I still think it needs a few more years before basically getting thrown to the sharks(no pun intended), if that's the expression I'm looking for?
Also, and maybe this is wishful thinking, but maybe if USASF takes finals down to 10 per division, they will also start to see less need for 345938745 bids going out during the year, as they're wasting their time with a vast majority of them, however as I said, this is wishful thinking, they wouldn't make NEAR the amount of money if only, let's say, 15 teams in small senior went to Worlds.

The issue is that providing one set of teams with an advantage in a competition means that you are, by definition, putting another set of teams at a disadvantage based on their address. Also, the 4th best team in the world should be able to have a better shot at getting 4th than the 10th best team.

 

[cheeeeer93]

I agree with @BlueCat I feel like once your at worlds you should be treated all the same. Not all at large bids are so bad off as some people make it seem. Take Orlando Angels for instance they just missed out on getting a paid bid this year, and did go on a at large, but they still placed top 5 beating out some teams that correct me if I am wrong had recieved a full paid bid. Then theres also Cheer Corp Generals from small senior that placed 10th in small senior on a at large bid also.

CJA, World Cup Suns, and Just Cheer all went on full paid bids and placed in the bottom half in finals.

 

[yojaehs]

@BlueCat I just want to say AMEN to everything you said!!! I'd like to add 3 per country during the USASF is stupid.

 

[glitterdiva]

@yojaehs I'm curious do you have anything positive to say about the usasf? It just seems like anytime the usasf is mentioned you just start attacking them.

 

[yojaehs]

@yojaehs I'm curious do you have anything positive to say about the usasf? It just seems like anytime the usasf is mentioned you just start attacking them.

Haha, now that's funny. Do I hate the USASF, no. Do I feel there is room for improvement, yes. Universal score sheet, teams in finals and venue, I will continue to voice my opinion. Worlds a great place for the best of the best to have a showdown, absolutely, I just wanna see it be the best it can be.
P.S. @glitterdiva thanks for following!

 

[ztaprincess]

If we do this whole 10 to finals thing, I'd love to see small and small limited in the Josten's center day one. Free up some room for IOAG 5 and IOC 5 (two VERY competitive and also very popular divisions) in the Milkhouse for at least one day of the weekend. I think all club divisions need to have finals in the Milkhouse, as much as I love the international divisions, club divisions should be priority there, it's mostly those teams (Especially large senior) that bring the HUGE amount of people.

Those international teams coming from other countries are also paying twice as much if not more to get there so why should they not have the chance to compete in the milkhouse? I won't get into this because there was already a thread arguing about it, but this statement kind of made it seem like the international teams are not as important as the senior club teams and I just can't agree with that. More people cheered for Bangkok then several other senior teams.

On to the actual topic of finals I would love to see it down to top 10 on in finals. This is Worlds, which should be the best of the best going for the gold globe. I like the idea of having the prelims, semis, and finals like they did for the large divisions this past worlds. That way you have at least two shots at making it into the top 10 of that division to go to finals. It will give those teams that could have made it but had mistakes to take another shot at it.

 

[chyeeaaa69]

Those international teams coming from other countries are also paying twice as much if not more to get there so why should they not have the chance to compete in the milkhouse? I won't get into this because there was already a thread arguing about it, but this statement kind of made it seem like the international teams are not as important as the senior club teams and I just can't agree with that. More people cheered for Bangkok then several other senior teams.

On to the actual topic of finals I would love to see it down to top 10 on in finals. This is Worlds, which should be the best of the best going for the gold globe. I like the idea of having the prelims, semis, and finals like they did for the large divisions this past worlds. That way you have at least two shots at making it into the top 10 of that division to go to finals. It will give those teams that could have made it but had mistakes to take another shot at it.

yes, there's ONE international team that people want to pay attention to. What I meant was that if you put multiple club divisions in the Josten's center, it's going to turn out badly, because, regardless of how you personally feel (I also thoroughly enjoy the international divisions), more people care about club division finals than a vast majority of the teams competing in international divisions

 

[chyeeaaa69]

Why bother? With 3 teams, does it really matter that much who goes first or last? I have to say, I'm a little disappointed that its just a given that your in finals, especially for WORLDS.

not saying I agree with it, but there would be a whole lot of angry fans if (using 2011 Worlds as an example, let's pretend only F5, Stars, and CEA were there in large) only Stars and F5 competed day 2.

 

[ztaprincess]

yes, there's ONE international team that people want to pay attention to. What I meant was that if you put multiple club divisions in the Josten's center, it's going to turn out badly, because, regardless of how you personally feel (I also thoroughly enjoy the international divisions), more people care about club division finals than a vast majority of the teams competing in international divisions

I know I said I wouldn't really get into it, but people say it isn't fair the way it is set up right now, but if you move all the senior club divisions to the milkhouse and the international divisions to jostens it still isn't fair. You can either have it fair and everyone gets the chance to compete in it at least once or you have only the divisions people think are most important. If people only want what is most important then they have to stop saying things aren't fair because that isn't going to fix things and make them fair. This is a good conversation but I will end it so we don't clog this thread with something that already has a thread about it.

 

[garretttt]

Id like atleast top 20 going to finals, but then again i love sm sr.

 

[Deleted member 1556]

Id like atleast top 20 going to finals, but then again i love sm sr.

I would say in divisions as large as small senior and small coed, where theres about 50-60 teams, there should be a top 20, or a top 15. Everywhere else, top 10.

 

[cheerheart4life]

I totally agree with the top ten going to finals! Then the crowd gets to see the best of the best and the venue isnt overly crowded with a billion teams. I cant imagine competing three times in one weekend though. I understand that it shows consistency but its seems like alot after teams travel so far