All-Star 3 Major Changes To Address 3 Major Problems

[Mclovin]

To give you numbers, our liability premium on a standard fitness facility is about 2k a month. Add a diving board to one of the pools, 4k a month. Do a high risk athletic activity, say skate boarding, rock wall climbing or cheer (yeah, they know what it is and the risks, even have definitions about tumbling, building, etc), goes to 6-8k per month. Now, I'm not a big fan of any of what has gone on from either side on this issue, but a bit of dialogue and interaction is needed now, not yelling at eachother and sounds like this is an attempt to move forward.

But if our own gyms can afford this premium, why can't EP's??

 

[King]

How do gymnastics facilities get insurance then? How about football? Hockey? Why is cheer the only sport insurance companies aren't wanting to insure?

Because we aren't that organized and, in all honesty, there isn't much consequence for people who mess up tumbling.

 

[Mclovin]

Because we aren't that organized and, in all honesty, there isn't much consequence for people who mess up tumbling.

So we punish the kid rather than the sanction the coaches/gyms who don't know what the heck they're doing....

 

[imrichhowboutu]

So we punish the kid rather than the sanction the coaches/gyms who don't know what the heck they're doing....

How many kids are being punished here? A few hundred out of hundreds of thousands? There are still plenty of skills that these athletes can work on and develop.


How about front handspring front full step out RO HS Double. I've never seen a cheerleader do that yet it is completely legal and extremely difficult. Have at it kids.

 

[Mclovin]

How many kids are being punished here? A few hundred out of hundreds of thousands? There are still plenty of skills that these athletes can work on and develop.


How about front handspring front full step out RO HS Double. I've never seen a cheerleader do that yet it is completely legal and extremely difficult. Have at it kids.

Until they get injured doing that, too, then the USASF will ban front fulls as well...blind landings are hard and very dangerous...

 

[imrichhowboutu]

Until they get injured doing that, too, then the USASF will ban front fulls as well...blind landings are hard and very dangerous...

That is correct, however right now the % of injuries from them is at a 0 since no one is doing them.

 

[StarshipTrooper]

But if our own gyms can afford this premium, why can't EP's??

I'm just putting facts out there and commenting on how it effected our ability to get by with 80-100 cheerleaders 5 years ago. Again, the premiums for our gym, about 5 years ago, were to go up approximately 4k a month just for cheer, they charge on the highest risk and that was the highest risk. Now, I'd have to get a price. I assume everyone must charge enough to cover the premiums, but there are only 2 insurers that will consider just the gym now, and will not cover a diving board so I don't know, things are clearly worse than they were. It is probably a valid concern to discuss in the open.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

StarshipTrooper 2 shimmy's in one day for you! The USASF isn't the only one making history here!

 

[MomOf2ThatsMe]

How many kids are being punished here? A few hundred out of hundreds of thousands? There are still plenty of skills that these athletes can work on and develop.


How about front handspring front full step out RO HS Double. I've never seen a cheerleader do that yet it is completely legal and extremely difficult. Have at it kids.

I'm pretty sure one of the girls on our SO5 threw that. Or at least something very close. But I'm almost positive she came from gymnastics.

 

[StarshipTrooper]

StarshipTrooper 2 shimmy's in one day for you! The USASF isn't the only one making history here!

The End Times are indeed upon us. I do think consensus must prevail, and the mob mentality of social media will exert heavy influence which is fine, but will not promote solutions. I hope the message board can be positive. I know some of the players and obviously they do not care what I think, but they are good people. There are so many intertwined agendas that it is going to be tough. Maybe a crisis can accelerate a solution.

 

[Mclovin]

That is correct, however right now the % of injuries from them is at a 0 since no one is doing them.

I want to see the stats the USASF has on the percentage of injuries on the skills they've banned. Show me the proof. Don't just tell me it's happening. Then when you show me those statistics, tell me how many of those injuries were in gyms where coaches have no business coaching the level they're coaching. Ban the gyms, not the skills....

 

[imrichhowboutu]

I want to see the stats the USASF has on the percentage of injuries on the skills they've banned. Show me the proof. Don't just tell me it's happening. Then when you show me those statistics, tell me how many of those injuries were in gyms where coaches have no business coaching the level they're coaching. Ban the gyms, not the skills....

You can't have an organization like that. You need to identify the problem and remedy it. You need proper education and awareness.

 

[Mclovin]

You can't have an organization like that. You need to identify the problem and remedy it. You need proper education and awareness.

Why can't we?? And we HAVE identified the problem...Coaches teaching skills they aren't qualified to teach!! And gyms allowing kids to throw skills they aren't read to throw... Remedy it by doing just what I stated earlier.

 

[Katie_katiexx]

How many kids are being punished here? A few hundred out of hundreds of thousands? There are still plenty of skills that these athletes can work on and develop.


How about front handspring front full step out RO HS Double. I've never seen a cheerleader do that yet it is completely legal and extremely difficult. Have at it kids.

I agree with many of your points, or at least think they come from a valid perspective that should be expressed throughout this....for lack of a better word, ordeal...BUT, many people have stated that injuries are happening on large part due to a general low quality of coaches....Tumbling is not my strongest suit, but i am completely comfortable and feel confident teaching a kid to standing full, or whip double....I would not feel qualified to teach or spot that pass, and would call in a superior coach for assistance.

The point i am trying to make here, is that if the rules are being restricted with the intentions of preventing injury caused by under qualified coaches, they are unsuccessful. The skills eliminated are not necessarily the "hardest" or "most likely to cause injury" but skills still included are more difficult, and it could be argued they are more likely to result in injury as a result of poor coaching.

I wish i had a good suggestion on how to fix the problem, but at this point i don't.

 

[magical mom]

1) Educate, educate, educate. Most injuries are due to little or no education. Skill progression education. If we compare ourselves to gymnastics what are the studies for athlete injuries in gymnastics? less? more? Maybe we need to look at the progression in gymanstics and follow a similar structure.

2) Age limits Im ok with to an extent. Im fine with having an minimum age cap on level 1-4 sr teams. I dont understand the youth age raised to 12. Is this a safety issue? What did that do? Im not understanding the international age either. Is this due to older kids being with younger kids? I think it needs to be the owner/coach descretion if a younger kids should be on an older team, not a rule that is put in placed. Lets hold the owners and coaches more accountable on issues like these. I think we are all pretty much ok with the fact that we need to make the correct judgement. Thats' what #1 would do, educate!!!

3)Image....... Ok we all are part of this all star world. We created it, we established it, we made it what it is today. 15 years ago we had crop tops, makeup, bows, etc. We made the image what it is and it has grown into a mulit million dollar industry that has created a great sport for athletes. All star cheer is crop tops, big bows, makeup. All stars cheer is performance (from males & females) and excitement. This is what we created. This is what this sport is about. If as a parent I didnt like the look of all star cheerleading then I as a parent would choose something else for my child to be associated with.

An added extra......Having to big of bows dosent make my child look inappropriate, having her uniform on walking around during the day dosent make my child look inappropriate, and by no means does my male cheerleaders acting theatrical make my child look innappropriate. Celebrating with to much excitement doesnt hurt my childs safety nor does it make her look inappropriate. Hmmmm......