All-Star Cheer Extreme Questions And Answers From Courtney

[cheerinfo]

Nice objective moderation there. The fact that what you are saying is incorrect and bordering on blatantly dishonest should cause you pause. What years did CEA do this, and we were on the Jr. team 2004-2008? 2009? MsTeal has debunked this from 2010 on, and I can guarantee you it did not happen in the preceeding years. No back pedaling from CEA, more like misinformation from you. I call your spade and raise a royal flush.

Now the rest of the stuff, that is up to you. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and you are the moderator and can handle the personal stuff as you see fit, but you cannot create your own facts out of thin air and post as a moderater as if they are true. You people are really unbelievable. Again, CEA belongs on the stage, and we do have have to break the rules or the spirit of "sportmanship" to win.

Just because I have an opinion on a matter makes me impartial as a moderator?? And I didn't mean "monitor" as a moderator, I meant monitoring as a poster...i held off posting anything until McLovin's Christianity was brought into a CHEERLEADING discussion..really??

And just because MsTeal says something on the boards does mean it is debunked to the entire world. She has made her statements, as have you and others. What I choose to believe is up to me, and to be honest, I just don't believe all of it. I don't believe that everyone else is making up facts that tell them that kids were put on a Dallas team in teh j5 division during certain years. Moreover, I have no clue why any of you from CEA would be ashamed of that...who cares, it's legal, smart maybe even. I'm not saying I really care...what I am saying is that I believe it to be true. I am not creating facts. I am taking things I have heard from both sides, now and in years past, and formulating what I think is the truth. Either way, it really doesn't matter. And the world will carry on.

HOWEVER, my post was more in response to the RUDENESS in which McLovin was spoken to in one post.

And the years I would say I heard about a combined jr 5 team would be from 2005 or so on. Not meaning EVERY year...but yes, I heard "rumblings" about it even then. Again...I DON'T CARE, just stating that I DID hear it, just like others are saying they heard it. And we are not all from the same gym or area of the country. Anyway...my opinion doesn't make me an impartial moderator of this board. I was not even referring to that. I'm pretty sure kingston has many opinions that people don't share, but just because he runs the board doesn't mean he can't post if he feels the need.

Anyhoo...carry on...just don't think questioning someone's religion over cheerleading is appropriate or necessary.

 

[tumbleyoda]

Maybe it should be 'evaluations' instead of 'tryouts'...that way someone doesn't go 'RAWRRR SANDBAGGING SUPERTEAM OF AWESOME RAWWWRR TORCHES AND PITCHFORKS!!'

For some reason I imagine the above being roared by a T-Rex. Probably because it's 1 am and I need sleep..

That would be a 'Teal" Rex

One thing I have observed about the word tryout from several programs - not just CEA. Many of the more competitive programs use it to foster in house competition. It is not just isolated to the normal "tryout" season of April - August. Even if they do mid year team adjustments, new teams, etc this keeps the athletes on their toes not to lose skills, and the parents - esp those that are the Suzie mom types to keep them in the gym at risk of potentially losing that spot on the coveted team later on in the year. The mindset seems to be that the athletes and parents will "value" their placement or making a certain team more than if they were simply evaluated.

 

[StarshipTrooper]

Just because I have an opinion on a matter makes me impartial as a moderator?? And I didn't mean "monitor" as a moderator, I meant monitoring as a poster...i held off posting anything until McLovin's Christianity was brought into a CHEERLEADING discussion..really??

And just because MsTeal says something on the boards does mean it is debunked to the entire world. She has made her statements, as have you and others. What I choose to believe is up to me, and to be honest, I just don't believe all of it. I don't believe that everyone else is making up facts that tell them that kids were put on a Dallas team in teh j5 division during certain years. Moreover, I have no clue why any of you from CEA would be ashamed of that...who cares, it's legal, smart maybe even. I'm not saying I really care...what I am saying is that I believe it to be true. I am not creating facts. I am taking things I have heard from both sides, now and in years past, and formulating what I think is the truth. Either way, it really doesn't matter. And the world will carry on.

HOWEVER, my post was more in response to the RUDENESS in which McLovin was spoken to in one post.

And the years I would say I heard about a combined jr 5 team would be from 2005 or so on. Not meaning EVERY year...but yes, I heard "rumblings" about it even then. Again...I DON'T CARE, just stating that I DID hear it, just like others are saying they heard it. And we are not all from the same gym or area of the country. Anyway...my opinion doesn't make me an impartial moderator of this board. I was not even referring to that. I'm pretty sure kingston has many opinions that people don't share, but just because he runs the board doesn't mean he can't post if he feels the need.

Anyhoo...carry on...just don't think questioning someone's religion over cheerleading is appropriate or necessary.

You take care of the rudeness and personal stuff, fine, I have no interest in that either. Did I quote that part of your post? Your facts from 2005 are wrong, I was there. I tell you why it happens, you try to diminish the hard work and accomplishments of our athletes with bogus claims of "excessive crossovers" (you used it again), bad sportsmanship, bad ethics and this happens all too frequently here and you did it in your posting and under your avatar it says moderator. Please stop with the misinformation and mischaracterization of our kids and their accomplishments. Whether you believe the truth or not is nothing I can control, but I can challenge your misinformation. And as soon as you people want to stop, I'll be glad not to reply.

 

[cheermommaRN]

:enjoyshow:

 

[cheerinfo]

You take care of the rudeness and personal stuff, fine, I have no interest in that either. Did I quote that part of your post? Your facts from 2005 are wrong, I was there. I tell you why it happens, you try to diminish the hard work and accomplishments of our athletes with bogus claims of "excessive crossovers" (you used it again), bad sportsmanship, bad ethics and this happens all too frequently here and you did it in your posting and under your avatar it says moderator. Please stop with the misinformation and mischaracterization of our kids and their accomplishments. Whether you believe the truth or not is nothing I can control, but I can challenge your misinformation. And as soon as you people want to stop, I'll be glad not to reply.

I have said NOTHING to diminish anyone's accomplishments! And CEA does use excessive crossovers...I didn't even think that was being debated on. Kids at CEA (LOTS of kids) double and even triple compete. I never criticized that here or gave an opinion on it. Why? Because unless and until there is something that makes excessive crossing over "illegal", there's nothing to debate, only something to opine on. I do not think I am misinformed or mischaracterizing anything, that is your opinion and you are entitled to it. As a moderator, I am still allowed to post, even if it is not always in agreeance with you or anyone else. I do not believe my information is false, even if you say it is. So we'll agree to disagree on that. It makes no difference. But I NEVER said anything about CEA's wins not being legit or being unfair or anything like that. CEA works the system in their own way that works for them. Just as I would suspect ALL gyms do. If crossovers work for you...have at it! Doesn't mean everyone will support it, understand it, agree with it, etc. But don't tell me I am diminishing the accomplishments of ANYONE by anything I have posted. CEA has won fair and square, within the rules. So not sure why you're getting all riled up at ME of all people. I'm not on here hating CEA or anyone. And with this post, I think I have nothing futher to say, I've said it all, you can debate it or disagree with it all you want, and that is fine. But I do not think CEA's wins are diminished in MY mind because of crossovers. So know that.

 

[StarshipTrooper]

I have said NOTHING to diminish anyone's accomplishments! And CEA does use excessive crossovers...I didn't even think that was being debated on. Kids at CEA (LOTS of kids) double and even triple compete. I never criticized that here or gave an opinion on it. Why? Because unless and until there is something that makes excessive crossing over "illegal", there's nothing to debate, only something to opine on. I do not think I am misinformed or mischaracterizing anything, that is your opinion and you are entitled to it. As a moderator, I am still allowed to post, even if it is not always in agreeance with you or anyone else. I do not believe my information is false, even if you say it is. So we'll agree to disagree on that. It makes no difference. But I NEVER said anything about CEA's wins not being legit or being unfair or anything like that. CEA works the system in their own way that works for them. Just as I would suspect ALL gyms do. If crossovers work for you...have at it! Doesn't mean everyone will support it, understand it, agree with it, etc. But don't tell me I am diminishing the accomplishments of ANYONE by anything I have posted. CEA has won fair and square, within the rules. So not sure why you're getting all riled up at ME of all people. I'm not on here hating CEA or anyone. And with this post, I think I have nothing futher to say, I've said it all, you can debate it or disagree with it all you want, and that is fine. But I do not think CEA's wins are diminished in MY mind because of crossovers. So know that.

If you had the ability to walk in the shoes of a CEA athlete/parent and listen to the continuous drumbeat coming here from you and others you may have some idea how you and others come off in this posting. Since you either do not, or will not. I stand by how you sound to me a I'll bet most associated with CEA. I assume you do not care.

 

[Mclovin]

At NCA in 2010 CEA won large junior 5, small
Junior coed 5 and youth 5. All representative of the teams chosen at tryouts. Both junior teams were equivalently talented one from kville one from Raleigh. You are mistaken on your
Mega team junior tryout theory. As superstitions go we tend to have better luck in even years

There was no compilation.......that's what we're saying. The teams going to Dallas were stacked.....but they were stacked from tryouts. Doesn't everybody do that? Put your best of a certain age/level on a team together to be the most competitive?

Because the kids like it and it makes them feel special. No harm no foul!

That was 2011.......I've already answered this question. 34 kids were original member's of the team. 2 were new add on's from the other Jr team. The friend and my cp were already on this team originally, they were just excited to keep their spots. 2010 my CP was on YE at NCA.....your other friend was on Jr All Girl 5.

I understand that completely. My point in stating the numbers is that I think what people are calling "tryouts" is really just a reevaluation of the team at that particular time in the season. It's not open tryouts for a whole new team. Maybe we should use another word or something. IDK. LOL

So to recap...

Ceacoach says all kids competing at NCA were representative of them teams chosen at tryouts...
mstealtoyou says there was no compilation
mstealtoyou then says they were already on junior elite just excited to "keep their spots"
mstealtoyou then says what we are calling tryouts she calls a "reevaluation"

I think it is clear that we are all saying the same thing. It's tit for tat. CEA calls it a reevaluation, I call it a tryout.

It's all on facebook. The posts are still there. I'm not sure how a parent can be excited that their kid "made the Dallas team" when they were already on the team... Come on people. It is very clear, even by the posts made in this thread, that there was a "reevaluation" of the kids that were on junior elite to make sure they were still "good enough" to keep their spots on the team for Dallas. We're playing symantics now. Regardless of whether 34 kids got to "keep their spot" or 10 kids got to "keep their spot", there was obviously a "situation" going on that gave the coaches an opportunity to replace whomever they wanted to make sure the team going to Dallas was as strong as it could be. In this particular situation it sounds like the coaches realized the team they put together at tryouts WAS the best group of athletes to take. But during their reevaluation it COULD have ended with a different result.

I want to make it very clear that I am in NO WAY saying that team didn't earn their win. This has absolutely NOTHING to do with wins or losses, but EVERYTHING to do with transparency and honesty.

As a parent you learn to "read between the lines" of what your child is telling you. That's where you'll find the truth of the situation. Regardless of how anyone wants to explain what occurred, it is very clear by postings on facebook and by multiple private messages I had with different parents that were involved in the "reevaluation", those kids were led to believe they had to "tryout" for a spot to go to Dallas. We're all saying the same thing. I may have gotten my teams confused and situations confused, but I know for an absolute fact that I did not misinterpret what was said on facebook.

 

[Mo-Lissa]

@StarshipTrooper

Example 1
The terminology your gym choses to use is what has everyone up in arms.
Courtney Smith-Pope
Reminder:
Monday Mar 5
Tiny's 5:30-6:30
Mini 2 5:30-7
Sr Teal 7-9
Tuesday Mar 6
Youth Elite 6:00-7:30
Med AG/Med CoEd 7:30-9:15(worlds team tryouts)
Wednesday
5:30-7:30 mini elite
7:00-9:30 SE
7-9:30 Coed Elite (Salem)
Thursday
Jr silver 6:00-7:30
Jr Excel 7:30-9:00

Like​

· · Share · March 1 at 6:04pm near Browns Summit, NC ·

The word tryout is loosely used here. You are a very educated man so you can understand the rest of us wondering the use of the word. You have let us now know this means re-evaluations to replace the 10 crossovers, but I do think if this term was used the same way to describe the "dallas" team that is where this is coming from.

Example 2

I personally witnessed an athlete compete for 3 different "locations" last season with a difference of about 3 hours between 2 of the locations. This is where my question as to what defines a gym comes into play, location, a name, a tax id number.
I-40 W

2 hrs 56 mins / 175.04 miles​

Greenville, NC to Colfax, NC.​

​

Example 3

I personally know an athlete that was on a CEA team and won a bid at Cheersport, but did not compete at Worlds. She was replaced. This was several years ago, maybe her skills regressed?? As a parent I would have been disappointed. But I know the athlete was upset she did not compete with the team.

Example 4

I personally know an athlete that was on another team out of the Sanford area that competed with a team all season last year, but his standing double looked awesome on the Worlds floor for coed elite last season. This athlete I almost raised the first 5 years of his cheer career, so I KNOW he was on the floor at Worlds last year!!

ALL OF THIS IS LEGAL!!!!! I in no way, shape, or form am I saying it is cheating!!!! My question then becomes what is fair, What is ethical, who makes and polices the rules, what is greed, what is the green monster of envy I might hold?

I will say in my 17 years in this crazy industry, I applaud Courtney for what she has been she has accomplished!! I watched her grow from her little gym. I am not sure if all the "BIGGER" gyms do the exact same things??? You all are the closest so of course I know your athletes. If I lived in Birmingham, I might feel this way about ACE?? I just wonder where it ends?? Only the bigs survive?? You know as well as I do MOST and saying MOST meaning die hard cheer families that have gifted children at some point in the smaller gym atmosphere ask in NC, should I take my kid to CEA she has a double, ect. Our gym does not field a team like that. You get my point, you all get a lot of talent passed your way!! NOT saying they don't get even better being placed with kids of similar talent.

Sorry Starship for the ramble, but wanted you to see it from the small side!!!

 

[Mclovin]

Oh really? Could have fooled me...bc it seems like despite it being explained over and over and over and over again..you either A) can't read B) lack general comprehension skills or C) Lying about the bolded part above. Just look at all of your posts below dude! Jesus christ..you couldn't even get your own facts straight and despite being told over and over about the whole "tryout" issue for the "special Dallas team", not only did you flat out ignore it, but you continued to hammer at mstealtoyou (mostly) necessarily. Considering she answered you accurately the FIRST time, I think you owe her an apology!

After reading your slew of posts, it would appear to me that you are bitter and looking for any answer to cry foul play, despite the fact the answer has been the same (and addressed) every time you have asked. Although I suppose that when you tell me you aren't bitter and I'm mistaken, I'll continue to go on for 3 or 4 more pages stating the same thing (but slightly changing my wording or remembering facts I originally stated incorrectly).

Isn't T&S openly Christian gym?!!

A) I can read
B) Sometimes I do lack comprehension skills. That isn't a strong suit for me.
C) I don't lie so that's definitely not the case

I admit I did not get my facts straight on the whole situation. I apologize. It's been two years since it happened and I had my facts crossed. There was no "stacked" small junior coed team. Holden was the only one added to that team. The "Dallas Team" situation happened in K'Ville only.

I want to make it VERY clear that I happen to have a lot of respect for mstealtoyou. She has always been very nice and cordial to me over the years. The only reason I am directing my questions at her is because she's the one who responded to them initially. It isn't personal. And if it will make you feel better... I'M SORRY mstealtoyou if I hammered you. I did not intend on attacking you, just wanted to get the facts clearly stated as I believe we were both saying the same thing but in different words.

I am most definitely not bitter, I can promise you that. And I have NEVER cried foul on CEA's wins, ever, at any competition, with any team. Being "sad" that my CP's team had zero chance of winning because of what I believed to be a "stacked" team made especially for Dallas does NOT mean I think they cheated or didn't deserve their wins in any way. Please don't put words in my mouth.

T&S is most definitely a christian owned and operated gym. And I myself am very proud to say I am a christian. I do not believe I have said anything on this thread to call that into question. I am allowed to ask questions. I am allowed to expect straight answers. That doesn't mean the gym I am affiliated with is bogus in it's claim to be christian owned and operated, nor does it mean I am a hypocrite. If you knew me at all you would know this part of your post is absurd. I'm sorry you feel that my questioning Courtney in a thread where she ASKED for questions is inappropriate for me to do because of my faith. Just because I didn't feel I was getting a straight answer doesn't mean I'm evil...

 

[Cheerfan1234]

Speaking of Christianity, Social networking can be the Devil. Case in point

 

[lakerfantlc]

Just going to throw it out there one more time...so much of this could have been avoided by taking care of "business" in house and NOT posting all the going's on. Using crossovers more sparingly would go a long ways to cut this conversation as well. I am hoping people will read this and decide using crossovers to get bids etc isn't worth the hassle...first you have to go fill that hole in your roster...then you have to suffer through threads like this one to "explain"....not worth it IMHO

 

[Cheerfan1234]

Just going to throw it out there one more time...so much of this could have been avoided by taking care of "business" in house and NOT posting all the going's on. Using crossovers more sparingly would go a long ways to cut this conversation as well. I am hoping people will read this and decide using crossovers to get bids etc isn't worth the hassle...first you have to go fill that hole in your roster...then you have to suffer through threads like this one to "explain"....not worth it IMHO

Amen! No one would suffer if no one responded. CEA (or any other gym for that matter) doesn't owe anyone from other gyms any answers, which is why I'm shocked that if they stand so proudly by their ethics and philosophies that they're even dignifying anyone here with a response.

 

[Ashley]

Just going to throw it out there one more time...so much of this could have been avoided by taking care of "business" in house and NOT posting all the going's on. Using crossovers more sparingly would go a long ways to cut this conversation as well. I am hoping people will read this and decide using crossovers to get bids etc isn't worth the hassle...first you have to go fill that hole in your roster...then you have to suffer through threads like this one to "explain"....not worth it IMHO

Fortunately for you you're not a coach or gym owner. Clearly Courtney has decided that it is worth it to her gym. At the end of the day it doesn't matter what people on Fierceboard say about you, it matters how well your team does. And CEA has been quite successful.

 

[StarshipTrooper]

@StarshipTrooper

Example 1
The terminology your gym choses to use is what has everyone up in arms.
Courtney Smith-Pope
Reminder:
Monday Mar 5
Tiny's 5:30-6:30
Mini 2 5:30-7
Sr Teal 7-9
Tuesday Mar 6
Youth Elite 6:00-7:30
Med AG/Med CoEd 7:30-9:15(worlds team tryouts)
Wednesday
5:30-7:30 mini elite
7:00-9:30 SE
7-9:30 Coed Elite (Salem)
Thursday
Jr silver 6:00-7:30
Jr Excel 7:30-9:00

​

Like​

· · Share · March 1 at 6:04pm near Browns Summit, NC ·

The word tryout is loosely used here. You are a very educated man so you can understand the rest of us wondering the use of the word. You have let us now know this means re-evaluations to replace the 10 crossovers, but I do think if this term was used the same way to describe the "dallas" team that is where this is coming from.

Example 2

I personally witnessed an athlete compete for 3 different "locations" last season with a difference of about 3 hours between 2 of the locations. This is where my question as to what defines a gym comes into play, location, a name, a tax id number.
I-40 W

2 hrs 56 mins / 175.04 miles​

Greenville, NC to Colfax, NC.​

​

Example 3

I personally know an athlete that was on a CEA team and won a bid at Cheersport, but did not compete at Worlds. She was replaced. This was several years ago, maybe her skills regressed?? As a parent I would have been disappointed. But I know the athlete was upset she did not compete with the team.

Example 4

I personally know an athlete that was on another team out of the Sanford area that competed with a team all season last year, but his standing double looked awesome on the Worlds floor for coed elite last season. This athlete I almost raised the first 5 years of his cheer career, so I KNOW he was on the floor at Worlds last year!!

ALL OF THIS IS LEGAL!!!!! I in no way, shape, or form am I saying it is cheating!!!! My question then becomes what is fair, What is ethical, who makes and polices the rules, what is greed, what is the green monster of envy I might hold?

I will say in my 17 years in this crazy industry, I applaud Courtney for what she has been she has accomplished!! I watched her grow from her little gym. I am not sure if all the "BIGGER" gyms do the exact same things??? You all are the closest so of course I know your athletes. If I lived in Birmingham, I might feel this way about ACE?? I just wonder where it ends?? Only the bigs survive?? You know as well as I do MOST and saying MOST meaning die hard cheer families that have gifted children at some point in the smaller gym atmosphere ask in NC, should I take my kid to CEA she has a double, ect. Our gym does not field a team like that. You get my point, you all get a lot of talent passed your way!! NOT saying they don't get even better being placed with kids of similar talent.

Sorry Starship for the ramble, but wanted you to see it from the small side!!!

I'll let Courtney respond to that if she choses because I do not know the facts. I can tell you all this. WE AT CEA DO NOT CARE WHAT YOU DO INTERNALLY WITH YOUR TEAMS. I just have no idea why CEA is scrutinized at this level. One must conclude that either we beg and invite people to do this, or others are trying to point out these things in an attempt I believe is to diminish the kid's and the staff's success. The dreaded asterisk so to speak. Who else is put under this type of microscope? Maybe you can find incidences similar in similar gyms and post about them? However, I will tell you most of these kids doing the travelling and multiple teams do it themselves for their own reasons and not the behest of the staff. THEY want their kids seen on high profile teams. It would be crazy not to use a standing double at Worlds. How much you wanna bet that would happen anywhere?

 

[CharlotteASMom]

If you had the ability to walk in the shoes of a CEA athlete/parent and listen to the continuous drumbeat coming here from you and others you may have some idea how you and others come off in this posting. Since you either do not, or will not. I stand by how you sound to me a I'll bet most associated with CEA. I assume you do not care.

I would expect that you also understand that those of us that do not "walk in the shoes of CEA" have questions about issues that have been brought up in a thread created by your gym's owner.